5 ms·

I don't get it - wasn't it concluded that instantaneous communication is impossible, aka you can't transmit information EVEN if you were to take a decade to mov

I don't get it - wasn't it concluded that instantaneous communication is impossible, aka you can't transmit information EVEN if you were to take a decade to move two entangled particles apart, all you would get is data from 10 years ago?

grepfru_it 5y ago
FTL communication is not possible. You have access to the entangled particle right now but, to send information, you are bound to the limits of the classical channel (the 10 year problem transmitting information about the entanglement)
- fasdf23qwe 5y ago
  This would be correct if causality is an absolut certainty in all the universe, the whole time, but what if causality it actually isn't a certainty in some contexts? Tadah..you would get ala "FTL" comms enabled.
  - drdeca 5y ago
    Isn’t this just saying that if you could send a signal faster than c, then you could send a signal faster than c? I don’t see your point.
    - fasdf23qwe 5y ago
      Sorry, I didn't wanted to write it like that was psychosis somehow. I meant, causality as I understand, it could be not a fully understood concept. We could still find evidence - in the future - that there are phenomena capable of "evade" the cause-effect principle. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faster-than-light_neutrino_anomaly https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faster-than-light_neutrino_ano...
    - fasdf23qwe 5y ago
      To add more speculation, the idea from the movie "Tenet" could be a way to effectively surpase C in long distance communications: reversed entropy matter. You could just send a ship or some kind of vesel with reversed entropy to a star and it will arrive years later, but years sooner that it was launched. Matter is more or less energy, what if this trick could be done with reversed entropy energy: radio, x-rays, gamma rays, etc.
      - mr_toad 5y ago
        You can reverse entropy with a refrigerator, but I don’t think that will allow FTL communication.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- binarybanana 5y ago
  But what if you had a spinning black hole to play with? Couldn't you strategically place a bunch of satellites in various orbits around it and use the frame dragging effects in either direction to manipulate signals into arriving arrive somewhere else at arbitrary times by sending them around often enough? I can think of two ways in which one would still be limited though. First is that one is limited to dragging signals only as far back as when the necessary machinery was first put in place. This is analog to the limitation of the wormhole time travel hack where you accelerate one close to c, then slow it back down and put it in place again to increase the distance in time to the other end that was stationary the whole time. But perhaps even worse would be the hard limits on how much this could be used before the whole apparatus itself turns into a black hole by the sheer energy being sent back from the far future. it would be like a time lense effectively. Or less spectacularly, it might just get fried. Or perhaps a failsafe would just dump the signal before things get critical. In any case, there would be a limit to how much or from how far in the future one could use such a thing, but other than that it should work, right?

grepfru_it 5y ago

FTL communication is not possible. You have access to the entangled particle right now but, to send information, you are bound to the limits of the classical channel (the 10 year problem transmitting information about the entanglement)

fasdf23qwe 5y ago
This would be correct if causality is an absolut certainty in all the universe, the whole time, but what if causality it actually isn't a certainty in some contexts? Tadah..you would get ala "FTL" comms enabled.
- drdeca 5y ago
  Isn’t this just saying that if you could send a signal faster than c, then you could send a signal faster than c? I don’t see your point.
  - fasdf23qwe 5y ago
    Sorry, I didn't wanted to write it like that was psychosis somehow. I meant, causality as I understand, it could be not a fully understood concept. We could still find evidence - in the future - that there are phenomena capable of "evade" the cause-effect principle. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faster-than-light_neutrino_anomaly https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faster-than-light_neutrino_ano...
  - fasdf23qwe 5y ago
    To add more speculation, the idea from the movie "Tenet" could be a way to effectively surpase C in long distance communications: reversed entropy matter. You could just send a ship or some kind of vesel with reversed entropy to a star and it will arrive years later, but years sooner that it was launched. Matter is more or less energy, what if this trick could be done with reversed entropy energy: radio, x-rays, gamma rays, etc.
    - mr_toad 5y ago
      You can reverse entropy with a refrigerator, but I don’t think that will allow FTL communication.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
binarybanana 5y ago
But what if you had a spinning black hole to play with? Couldn't you strategically place a bunch of satellites in various orbits around it and use the frame dragging effects in either direction to manipulate signals into arriving arrive somewhere else at arbitrary times by sending them around often enough? I can think of two ways in which one would still be limited though. First is that one is limited to dragging signals only as far back as when the necessary machinery was first put in place. This is analog to the limitation of the wormhole time travel hack where you accelerate one close to c, then slow it back down and put it in place again to increase the distance in time to the other end that was stationary the whole time. But perhaps even worse would be the hard limits on how much this could be used before the whole apparatus itself turns into a black hole by the sheer energy being sent back from the far future. it would be like a time lense effectively. Or less spectacularly, it might just get fried. Or perhaps a failsafe would just dump the signal before things get critical. In any case, there would be a limit to how much or from how far in the future one could use such a thing, but other than that it should work, right?