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People don't seem to get how awesome this is. Sell it to parents. You can guarantee (for some period of time likely) that your children have an artificial tol

People don't seem to get how awesome this is. Sell it to parents. You can guarantee (for some period of time likely) that your children have an artificial tolerance for drug use w/o any ill effects. The only implication I would want to think about more is what happens next. If all or most high schoolers had been inoculated against hard drug use, does that just mean that people would buy larger quantities? Would the market simply adjust? Would more new designer drugs enter as alternatives?

palish 15y ago
"Sell it to parents. You can guarantee (for some period of time likely) that your children have an artificial tolerance for drug use w/o any ill effects." I don't understand what you're saying.
- burgerbrain 15y ago
  He is saying that there might be a market for it among parents who want to remove from their children the ability to experience drugs.
  - palish 15y ago
    Right. And how would they do that? It sounds like you're advocating slipping your children some drug without their knowledge, in order to prevent them from doing cocaine. Protip: My mom slipped me anti-depressants while telling me they were "vitamins". When I found out, I never trusted her again. Ever. I felt violated. Do this at your own risk. Protip #2: If they want to do cocaine, you're not going to be able to stop them. I don't know the answer, but slipping your kids some anti-drug drug probably isn't it.
    - burgerbrain 15y ago
      "It sounds like you're advocating slipping your children some drug without their knowledge, in order to prevent them from doing cocaine." That appears to be what the original person you were responding to was suggesting. I share your concern.
chimeracoder 15y ago
People would just shift to other drugs. This concept is nothing new; an analogous drug that provides tolerance for heroin already exists. But heroin addicts who are forced to take methadone (as opposed to those who take it to assuage withdrawal symptoms) typically just turn to other drugs. This drug would be useless for parents - it shouldn't be used to try and force someone else not to use cocaine, since they'll just turn to other drugs. Its only potential use case is the current drug user who wishes to stop but is afraid of the withdrawal period.
- btilly 15y ago
  Citation needed. This is the first time that I've heard the claim that giving someone methadone actively causes them to go to substitutes.
- wallawe 15y ago
  Heroin is an opiate with many alternatives from oxcontin to the aforementioned methadone. There are no generics for cocaine. It is a fairly unique drug that people either free base or snort. The next jump for someone who wants to get "up" would be meth but you don't see these two being used interchangeably for the most part. I think this proposed drug has viability.
btilly 15y ago
Absolutely. I've known parents whose kids have taken up cocaine and other hard drugs. The pattern has an inevitable up and down where the kids go through periods where they sincerely want to quit, and go through periods where they are lost to the drug. If a vaccine like this existed, it would be easy to get addicts to use it in periods where they are trying to kick the habit. And that would (for most) end the nightmare. Unless you've been close to a family going through this, it is hard to explain how much of a difference that would make.
Daniel_Newby 15y ago
You can guarantee (for some period of time likely) that your children have an artificial tolerance for drug use w/o any ill effects. Cocaine is used in doses (tens of milligrams) that are gigantic by the standards of the immune system. It takes aggressive immunization to create enough antibodies, which would produce frequent autoimmune disorders in a large population.
speckledjim 15y ago
Or, you could just teach parents to be.... good parents.
- badclient 15y ago
  Because good parenting can never lead to kids doing coke? Let's just agree to disagree on that one.
  - speckledjim 15y ago
    It's not a black and white thing, but good parenting certainly decreases the chances your child will go down the drugs path.
    - burgerbrain 15y ago
      Why? Should "good parenting" also decrease the chances of a child drinking alcohol? Pot? Shrooms? The apparent assumption here among many people that these substances are intrinsically bad is baffling to me. Where do you draw the line? Surely it can't be "legality", because several of the "schedule 1" drugs are completely harmless, and possibly even naturally occurring (in your own body!). If potential for bodily harm is the deciding factor, then we should be discussing alchohol "cures" looong before anything else. It is absurdly common and absurdly addictive.
      - speckledjim 15y ago
        > Why? Should "good parenting" also decrease the chances of a child drinking alcohol? Pot? Shrooms? Yes. Good parenting decreases the chances a child will break the law in general, or be in a self destructive place. Parenting has a lot of influence on children contrary to some peoples beliefs...
        burgerbrain 15y ago
        Alcohol is legal and pot is not destructive. Good parents should also teach their children the difference between legality and morality. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Kohlbergs_stages_of_moral_development http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Kohlbergs_stages_of_mo...
burgerbrain 15y ago
Next up: make vaccines that allow Mormon parents to render their children permanently unable to metabolize caffeine! Let Baptist parents permanently disable alcohol for their children! Let vegan parents artificially induce lactose intolerance in their kids! Hell, you could even let the socially conservative chemically neuter their children! Edit: I guess most people think that crippling their children, quite possibly before they are mature enough to give consent, is fine and dandy.

palish 15y ago

"Sell it to parents. You can guarantee (for some period of time likely) that your children have an artificial tolerance for drug use w/o any ill effects." I don't understand what you're saying.

burgerbrain 15y ago
He is saying that there might be a market for it among parents who want to remove from their children the ability to experience drugs.
- palish 15y ago
  Right. And how would they do that? It sounds like you're advocating slipping your children some drug without their knowledge, in order to prevent them from doing cocaine. Protip: My mom slipped me anti-depressants while telling me they were "vitamins". When I found out, I never trusted her again. Ever. I felt violated. Do this at your own risk. Protip #2: If they want to do cocaine, you're not going to be able to stop them. I don't know the answer, but slipping your kids some anti-drug drug probably isn't it.
  - burgerbrain 15y ago
    "It sounds like you're advocating slipping your children some drug without their knowledge, in order to prevent them from doing cocaine." That appears to be what the original person you were responding to was suggesting. I share your concern.

chimeracoder 15y ago

People would just shift to other drugs. This concept is nothing new; an analogous drug that provides tolerance for heroin already exists. But heroin addicts who are forced to take methadone (as opposed to those who take it to assuage withdrawal symptoms) typically just turn to other drugs. This drug would be useless for parents - it shouldn't be used to try and force someone else not to use cocaine, since they'll just turn to other drugs. Its only potential use case is the current drug user who wishes to stop but is afraid of the withdrawal period.

btilly 15y ago
Citation needed. This is the first time that I've heard the claim that giving someone methadone actively causes them to go to substitutes.
wallawe 15y ago
Heroin is an opiate with many alternatives from oxcontin to the aforementioned methadone. There are no generics for cocaine. It is a fairly unique drug that people either free base or snort. The next jump for someone who wants to get "up" would be meth but you don't see these two being used interchangeably for the most part. I think this proposed drug has viability.

btilly 15y ago

Absolutely. I've known parents whose kids have taken up cocaine and other hard drugs. The pattern has an inevitable up and down where the kids go through periods where they sincerely want to quit, and go through periods where they are lost to the drug. If a vaccine like this existed, it would be easy to get addicts to use it in periods where they are trying to kick the habit. And that would (for most) end the nightmare. Unless you've been close to a family going through this, it is hard to explain how much of a difference that would make.

Daniel_Newby 15y ago

You can guarantee (for some period of time likely) that your children have an artificial tolerance for drug use w/o any ill effects. Cocaine is used in doses (tens of milligrams) that are gigantic by the standards of the immune system. It takes aggressive immunization to create enough antibodies, which would produce frequent autoimmune disorders in a large population.

speckledjim 15y ago

Or, you could just teach parents to be.... good parents.

badclient 15y ago
Because good parenting can never lead to kids doing coke? Let's just agree to disagree on that one.
- speckledjim 15y ago
  It's not a black and white thing, but good parenting certainly decreases the chances your child will go down the drugs path.
  - burgerbrain 15y ago
    Why? Should "good parenting" also decrease the chances of a child drinking alcohol? Pot? Shrooms? The apparent assumption here among many people that these substances are intrinsically bad is baffling to me. Where do you draw the line? Surely it can't be "legality", because several of the "schedule 1" drugs are completely harmless, and possibly even naturally occurring (in your own body!). If potential for bodily harm is the deciding factor, then we should be discussing alchohol "cures" looong before anything else. It is absurdly common and absurdly addictive.
    - speckledjim 15y ago
      > Why? Should "good parenting" also decrease the chances of a child drinking alcohol? Pot? Shrooms? Yes. Good parenting decreases the chances a child will break the law in general, or be in a self destructive place. Parenting has a lot of influence on children contrary to some peoples beliefs...
      - burgerbrain 15y ago
        Alcohol is legal and pot is not destructive. Good parents should also teach their children the difference between legality and morality. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Kohlbergs_stages_of_moral_development http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lawrence_Kohlbergs_stages_of_mo...

burgerbrain 15y ago

Next up: make vaccines that allow Mormon parents to render their children permanently unable to metabolize caffeine! Let Baptist parents permanently disable alcohol for their children! Let vegan parents artificially induce lactose intolerance in their kids! Hell, you could even let the socially conservative chemically neuter their children! Edit: I guess most people think that crippling their children, quite possibly before they are mature enough to give consent, is fine and dandy.