6 ms·

Did the walkouts at Google change anything? Not only did Sundar enable the disgusting, predatory behavior of Vic Gundotra and Andy Rubin, but as far as I can te

Did the walkouts at Google change anything? Not only did Sundar enable the disgusting, predatory behavior of Vic Gundotra and Andy Rubin, but as far as I can tell, he’s still a darling of the press. Even on HN Sundar and Google get the kid gloves despite the abhorrence of the culture they created. Walkouts are pointless. True Employee organization and collective bargaining is the only answer to holding execs accountable , whether it’s at Google, Activision, or anywhere else.

tdeck 5y ago
Google removed its mandatory arbitration clause for sexual harassment cases in response to the walkout: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2019/02/21/technology/google-forced-arbitration.amp.html https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2019/02/21/tech... > True Employee organization and collective bargaining is the only answer to holding execs accountable , whether it’s at Google, Activision, or anywhere else. What do you imagine this path to "true employee organization" might look like, if it doesn't involve actions like these along the way?
micromacrofoot 5y ago
Walkouts are an easy way to get more attention to an issue and it costs an employer real money. A single action doesn't need to solve everything.
- taeric 5y ago
  The sceptic in me is unsure how much money this costs. They aren't an assembly line, so did any deadlines get pushed back? Similarly, they are not a services company, so no services were lost. Certainly bad press. And I hope it has impact. But I'm not seeing direct lines to it.
  - bigmattystyles 5y ago
    Agreed, human nature being what it is, I guarantee you most of the work missed during the walk out was made up that evening by the same employees working late without being asked to do so.
  - micromacrofoot 5y ago
    just the simple math of N productivity hours multiplied by ~500 employees... hard to quantify but greater than 0
  - wbc 5y ago
    World of Warcraft, the cash cow product, is getting content delayed according to one of the devs: https://twitter.com/JeffAHamilton/status/1419115702569472003 https://twitter.com/JeffAHamilton/status/1419115702569472003
    - cronix 5y ago
      Delays are common, and expected as par for the course in the game industry. No one blinks an eye at delays and most games seem to not launch when announced anyway (like most software). The question that matters is, will this actually cost them lost revenue in the long run, or just delay inevitable sales by however long the employees can hold out in a walkout/strike? A delay is just as good as money in the bank in the long run. Will people not buy the product because it was delayed? Will they care why it was delayed, or even know unless it was an in-game message? Some will, sure, but will they still make the purchase? Likely.
      - Talanes 5y ago
        World of Warcraft is a subscription-based product, so delays do directly lead to lost revenue as players get bored and cancel.
  - Jcowell 5y ago
    They are absolutely a service company since game nowadays are live service content (I.e fortnight). In Activision’s Case, numerous of their games rely on new content being worked on for seasonal releases , bug fixes , reports etc. Time not being spent working on such causes delays which of course cost money.
- 0xy 5y ago
  On the contrary, there's evidence that less time at work (especially a single day) can keep productivity the same or better. Look at 4 day work week experiments.
  - CheezeIt 5y ago
    Productivity per hour, or productivity per week?
drdeadringer 5y ago
> Did the walkouts at Google change anything? I was a "TVC" at Google several times. One of those times was during the walkout period. Even though I had no way of finding out about it until a lucky "right now in 3 minutes" time period, I participated. Whilst the walkouts may not have changed much on corporate or the outsourced "side-corporates" [the contract companies], it did change myself. For decades I've heard of strikes, read about walkouts ... stuff in history books ... documentaries on the History Channel back when the History Channel was the History Channel ... Seeing it live, participating in it live and in person -- added new color to the understanding. The live speakers, the live news cameramen right there, the whole deal.
- fhjkkkg 5y ago
  If this isn’t parody, and I am guessing it’s not, then it’s still a perfect depiction of what changed in the American left in the 1960s. Politics became more about changing the orientation of one’s mind than the orientation of one’s society. Walkouts are worthless.
  - tehjoker 5y ago
    A walkout is worthwhile if it signals that the employees are ready to strike.
    - 0xy 5y ago
      Which they aren't. The attempts to unionize Google employees have been a total failure. The union is extremely unpopular. Without collective support, there is no strike.
  - ecshafer 5y ago
    American Left went from solidarity, going against the corporates, and better salaries and conditions to supporting whatever the latest hot political stand is.
    - matheusmoreira 5y ago
smnrchrds 5y ago
A major global publication has written an article about it. Spotlight is shone on Activision Blizzard's culture. We have seen that the only way to get any sort of customer support out of big tech companies is making noise on social media. And it works when enough noise is made. This is the next level of that: making noise in publications with global reach. The management will be wise not to ignore it.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- fhjkkkg 5y ago
  “Sunlight is not a disinfectant; try gasoline” —Amber Frost
- ErikVandeWater 5y ago
  I don't think an article on the side of the front page of a foreign newspaper remotely compares to what the NYT center front page or NBC Nightly News spotlights would mean.
  - alksjdalkj 5y ago
    It's on the front page of the Washington Post and NPR.
- bulek 5y ago
  The Guardian will be tuned out as noise by anyone who doesn't already agree.
  - toofy 5y ago
    There is almost nothing which would change the minds of the people who don’t already understand these as problems. No one seeking change is targeting them as the audience. Though, in their own heads, they probably delude themselves into believing they are.
    - 5y ago
hkarthik 5y ago
It's unfortunate, but walkouts and other employee activism around social justice can achieve the opposite effect. The marginalized leave because they don't feel heard, and potential new hires who might represent change stop applying or responding to recruiting attempts because of the company's tarnished reputation. Over time this leads to increased marginalization and concentration of the vary behavior that provoked the activist response in the first place. The only thing that actually works is board level action and commitment to following through on the change. Boards can hold execs accountable.
- SquishyPanda23 5y ago
  Also the employees who agree with the sentiment but find the tactics to be naive (or worse) become less likely to speak out.
toofy 5y ago
We’ll you’re still talking about it all this time later, so at the very least it absolutely contributed to topics being in the conversational arena. We have to remember how many people still say “Did Occupy really change anything?” —- on its own? Of course not. However “The 99%” is absolutely a concept which every disconnected midwesterner now knows and understands what it means, in two small words. This is a concept which was not previously a dinner table conversation and Occupy flipped that on its head. And when we’re dealing with something that’s as complex and messy as superpowers and their economic systems, that is absolutely not something to hand-wave away and proclaim “it did nothing.” None of these incredibly ingrained societal problems will be solved from one single instance of a walkout, and frankly, it would be more than a bit myopic to expect they would. These are complex and messy issues and there isnt one single thing which will address any of them, it’s going to be a lot of single instances that add up to something over time–and I think most people understand this.

tdeck 5y ago

Google removed its mandatory arbitration clause for sexual harassment cases in response to the walkout: https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2019/02/21/technology/google-forced-arbitration.amp.html https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2019/02/21/tech... > True Employee organization and collective bargaining is the only answer to holding execs accountable , whether it’s at Google, Activision, or anywhere else. What do you imagine this path to "true employee organization" might look like, if it doesn't involve actions like these along the way?

micromacrofoot 5y ago

Walkouts are an easy way to get more attention to an issue and it costs an employer real money. A single action doesn't need to solve everything.

taeric 5y ago
The sceptic in me is unsure how much money this costs. They aren't an assembly line, so did any deadlines get pushed back? Similarly, they are not a services company, so no services were lost. Certainly bad press. And I hope it has impact. But I'm not seeing direct lines to it.
- bigmattystyles 5y ago
  Agreed, human nature being what it is, I guarantee you most of the work missed during the walk out was made up that evening by the same employees working late without being asked to do so.
- micromacrofoot 5y ago
  just the simple math of N productivity hours multiplied by ~500 employees... hard to quantify but greater than 0
- wbc 5y ago
  World of Warcraft, the cash cow product, is getting content delayed according to one of the devs: https://twitter.com/JeffAHamilton/status/1419115702569472003 https://twitter.com/JeffAHamilton/status/1419115702569472003
  - cronix 5y ago
    Delays are common, and expected as par for the course in the game industry. No one blinks an eye at delays and most games seem to not launch when announced anyway (like most software). The question that matters is, will this actually cost them lost revenue in the long run, or just delay inevitable sales by however long the employees can hold out in a walkout/strike? A delay is just as good as money in the bank in the long run. Will people not buy the product because it was delayed? Will they care why it was delayed, or even know unless it was an in-game message? Some will, sure, but will they still make the purchase? Likely.
    - Talanes 5y ago
      World of Warcraft is a subscription-based product, so delays do directly lead to lost revenue as players get bored and cancel.
- Jcowell 5y ago
  They are absolutely a service company since game nowadays are live service content (I.e fortnight). In Activision’s Case, numerous of their games rely on new content being worked on for seasonal releases , bug fixes , reports etc. Time not being spent working on such causes delays which of course cost money.
0xy 5y ago
On the contrary, there's evidence that less time at work (especially a single day) can keep productivity the same or better. Look at 4 day work week experiments.
- CheezeIt 5y ago
  Productivity per hour, or productivity per week?

drdeadringer 5y ago

> Did the walkouts at Google change anything? I was a "TVC" at Google several times. One of those times was during the walkout period. Even though I had no way of finding out about it until a lucky "right now in 3 minutes" time period, I participated. Whilst the walkouts may not have changed much on corporate or the outsourced "side-corporates" [the contract companies], it did change myself. For decades I've heard of strikes, read about walkouts ... stuff in history books ... documentaries on the History Channel back when the History Channel was the History Channel ... Seeing it live, participating in it live and in person -- added new color to the understanding. The live speakers, the live news cameramen right there, the whole deal.

fhjkkkg 5y ago
If this isn’t parody, and I am guessing it’s not, then it’s still a perfect depiction of what changed in the American left in the 1960s. Politics became more about changing the orientation of one’s mind than the orientation of one’s society. Walkouts are worthless.
- tehjoker 5y ago
  A walkout is worthwhile if it signals that the employees are ready to strike.
  - 0xy 5y ago
    Which they aren't. The attempts to unionize Google employees have been a total failure. The union is extremely unpopular. Without collective support, there is no strike.
- ecshafer 5y ago
  American Left went from solidarity, going against the corporates, and better salaries and conditions to supporting whatever the latest hot political stand is.
  - matheusmoreira 5y ago

smnrchrds 5y ago

A major global publication has written an article about it. Spotlight is shone on Activision Blizzard's culture. We have seen that the only way to get any sort of customer support out of big tech companies is making noise on social media. And it works when enough noise is made. This is the next level of that: making noise in publications with global reach. The management will be wise not to ignore it.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
fhjkkkg 5y ago
“Sunlight is not a disinfectant; try gasoline” —Amber Frost
ErikVandeWater 5y ago
I don't think an article on the side of the front page of a foreign newspaper remotely compares to what the NYT center front page or NBC Nightly News spotlights would mean.
- alksjdalkj 5y ago
  It's on the front page of the Washington Post and NPR.
bulek 5y ago
The Guardian will be tuned out as noise by anyone who doesn't already agree.
- toofy 5y ago
  There is almost nothing which would change the minds of the people who don’t already understand these as problems. No one seeking change is targeting them as the audience. Though, in their own heads, they probably delude themselves into believing they are.
  - 5y ago

hkarthik 5y ago

It's unfortunate, but walkouts and other employee activism around social justice can achieve the opposite effect. The marginalized leave because they don't feel heard, and potential new hires who might represent change stop applying or responding to recruiting attempts because of the company's tarnished reputation. Over time this leads to increased marginalization and concentration of the vary behavior that provoked the activist response in the first place. The only thing that actually works is board level action and commitment to following through on the change. Boards can hold execs accountable.

SquishyPanda23 5y ago
Also the employees who agree with the sentiment but find the tactics to be naive (or worse) become less likely to speak out.

toofy 5y ago

We’ll you’re still talking about it all this time later, so at the very least it absolutely contributed to topics being in the conversational arena. We have to remember how many people still say “Did Occupy really change anything?” —- on its own? Of course not. However “The 99%” is absolutely a concept which every disconnected midwesterner now knows and understands what it means, in two small words. This is a concept which was not previously a dinner table conversation and Occupy flipped that on its head. And when we’re dealing with something that’s as complex and messy as superpowers and their economic systems, that is absolutely not something to hand-wave away and proclaim “it did nothing.” None of these incredibly ingrained societal problems will be solved from one single instance of a walkout, and frankly, it would be more than a bit myopic to expect they would. These are complex and messy issues and there isnt one single thing which will address any of them, it’s going to be a lot of single instances that add up to something over time–and I think most people understand this.