Yeah, you are totally right, the time factor of losing in MOBAs (I persoanlly played a lot of LoL in the past, and tried some DotA and HotS) pretty much defies

Yeah, you are totally right, the time factor of losing in MOBAs (I persoanlly played a lot of LoL in the past, and tried some DotA and HotS) pretty much defies my argument in that regard. But when I compare that to losing in Civ (not RTS, but strategy in general), I think I had a better feeling for why we lost. And it kind of fits in the scheme, as MOBAs are, in a broader sense, at least partially, a game of strategy. Not nesassarily when you start as new player, but winnign consistenly also takes thinking ahead a lot. What risks to take, which weakness to exploit, what item to buy. Theres a lot of just in time decisions to make, while also keeping the bigger picture in mind. Maybe MOBAs are just "direct action" enough to cater to a wider audiance, but strategy enough to share some of the same problems?