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I was pretty excited by this, so I went to pre-order. On the add-ons page, there are some nice additions like a leap motion controller. But there's also this:

I was pretty excited by this, so I went to pre-order. On the add-ons page, there are some nice additions like a leap motion controller. But there's also this: 2D-to-3D Conversion: 1000 Credits Convert 2D images into 3D depth images for holographic display. +$150.00 2D-to-3D Conversion: 100 Credits Convert 2D images into 3D depth images for holographic display. +$20.00 There's no mention of this type of per-interaction charging model on the product's splash page. Instead of excited I'm now disillusioned and irritated. Imagine Adobe tried to charge you every time you converted an image format in photoshop. Is the conversion process so complex that you need to upload a sample image to their servers or something? Why on earth can't I do that locally as many times as I like? It totally stymies experimentation.

errantspark 5y ago
I bet it's a NN that they've trained to make their image quilts based on photos and it may be hard to ship to the end user. That being said SaaS is a cancer upon humanity.
- enriquto 5y ago
  > it may be hard to ship to the end user just upload it to some publicly accessible website? It doesn't look that hard.
  - errantspark 5y ago
    Ship in this case doesn't mean "deliver an asset" but rather "deliver a user experience", nailing the latter consistently is non trivial. I do think people making SaaS products start by wanting to charge rent and then work backwards from there to a justification most of the time.
OliverM 5y ago
There's a bit more info about the process here: https://lookingglassfactory.com/3d-photos https://lookingglassfactory.com/3d-photos It is a cloud-based service, Owl3D. They use AI to deduce depth info from photos. You can subscribe to Owl3D directly, for $8 a month, and get 300 uploads per day for that (so, 9,000 a month for $8, vs 20 for $100 Looking Glass). I don't know if that direct Owl3D subscription can take advantage of depth info though: https://www.owl3d.ai/faqs https://www.owl3d.ai/faqs
perryizgr8 5y ago
This is only for converting 2d photos to 3d. If you have photos shot using portrait mode on Iphone/Galaxy/Pixel, they have a local tool that extracts depth info. AFAICT that is free, although it requires at least a GTX1650 for some reason.
- jaywalk 5y ago
  From the Minimum Requirements on the product page: HoloPlay Studio works with PC and Mac. To import, edit, process and convert depth photos, videos, and other holographic media, almost all PCs and Macs with HDMI and USB-C will work. To run and create heavier-duty interactive applications with Unity or Unreal, we recommend a PC with a GTX 1650 or equivalent, CPU with Intel i5 or higher, and at least 8GB of RAM.
- sp332 5y ago
  The iPhone captures depth when you take the photo. So the data just needs to be extracted, not generated from scratch.
  - perryizgr8 5y ago
    Yeah that's why I can't understand why they need a dedicated GPU.
    - jffry 5y ago
      See jaywalk's reply to you from earlier: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27982727 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27982727 It sounds like the discrete GPU is only needed for specific things which seem like they could reasonably need a discrete GPU (We're both talking about the "Minimum Requirements" section on https://lookingglassfactory.com/product/portrait https://lookingglassfactory.com/product/portrait, in the bottom right of the page below the big blue buy button)
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
beowulfey 5y ago
I mean, it's a 3D display. You need 3D things to use it. This is just a convenient service for converting your own 2D images. You can always bring your own 3D models/videos/etc into it, you don't need to pay them to do that. I personally don't see anything wrong with this.
- OliverM 5y ago
  There's no mention anywhere on their product page that you'll need to pay additional fees to convert 2d images to 3d to display them, or that you can perform this service yourself with a bit less convenience (which I'd be perfectly happy with).
  - beowulfey 5y ago
    They make the types of things that can be displayed on it pretty clear on their “Use Cases” page, IMO. I would not expect a 2D image to inherently show up on a 3D display; otherwise, what would the point be? Maybe your mindset is more indicative of the general population, but I do think most people understand that 3D holograms and 2D photos are different and would not expect a photo to suddenly have 3D properties on the display as if by magic (perhaps that is hoping too much though).
    - OliverM 5y ago
      I don't have the expectation that putting 2D photos onto a 3D would magically work. I expect to need to convert them (it's a bit much to assume that I would think otherwise). I don't expect to have to buy credits to convert them. There's no mention that I need to, until you get to the extras page when you go to purchase. That changes the entire set of assumptions I had (from "I can play with this and use it to explore whatever I find interesting", to "I have to pay to use it in a way they dictate"). Since then I've found that you probably don't need to do that. But that's not the impression that 'extra' gives. They don't mention anywhere that you don't need the credits to do the conversion.
      - rtkwe 5y ago

errantspark 5y ago

I bet it's a NN that they've trained to make their image quilts based on photos and it may be hard to ship to the end user. That being said SaaS is a cancer upon humanity.

enriquto 5y ago
> it may be hard to ship to the end user just upload it to some publicly accessible website? It doesn't look that hard.
- errantspark 5y ago
  Ship in this case doesn't mean "deliver an asset" but rather "deliver a user experience", nailing the latter consistently is non trivial. I do think people making SaaS products start by wanting to charge rent and then work backwards from there to a justification most of the time.

OliverM 5y ago

There's a bit more info about the process here: https://lookingglassfactory.com/3d-photos https://lookingglassfactory.com/3d-photos It is a cloud-based service, Owl3D. They use AI to deduce depth info from photos. You can subscribe to Owl3D directly, for $8 a month, and get 300 uploads per day for that (so, 9,000 a month for $8, vs 20 for $100 Looking Glass). I don't know if that direct Owl3D subscription can take advantage of depth info though: https://www.owl3d.ai/faqs https://www.owl3d.ai/faqs

perryizgr8 5y ago

This is only for converting 2d photos to 3d. If you have photos shot using portrait mode on Iphone/Galaxy/Pixel, they have a local tool that extracts depth info. AFAICT that is free, although it requires at least a GTX1650 for some reason.

jaywalk 5y ago
From the Minimum Requirements on the product page: HoloPlay Studio works with PC and Mac. To import, edit, process and convert depth photos, videos, and other holographic media, almost all PCs and Macs with HDMI and USB-C will work. To run and create heavier-duty interactive applications with Unity or Unreal, we recommend a PC with a GTX 1650 or equivalent, CPU with Intel i5 or higher, and at least 8GB of RAM.
sp332 5y ago
The iPhone captures depth when you take the photo. So the data just needs to be extracted, not generated from scratch.
- perryizgr8 5y ago
  Yeah that's why I can't understand why they need a dedicated GPU.
  - jffry 5y ago
    See jaywalk's reply to you from earlier: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27982727 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27982727 It sounds like the discrete GPU is only needed for specific things which seem like they could reasonably need a discrete GPU (We're both talking about the "Minimum Requirements" section on https://lookingglassfactory.com/product/portrait https://lookingglassfactory.com/product/portrait, in the bottom right of the page below the big blue buy button)
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]

beowulfey 5y ago

I mean, it's a 3D display. You need 3D things to use it. This is just a convenient service for converting your own 2D images. You can always bring your own 3D models/videos/etc into it, you don't need to pay them to do that. I personally don't see anything wrong with this.

OliverM 5y ago
There's no mention anywhere on their product page that you'll need to pay additional fees to convert 2d images to 3d to display them, or that you can perform this service yourself with a bit less convenience (which I'd be perfectly happy with).
- beowulfey 5y ago
  They make the types of things that can be displayed on it pretty clear on their “Use Cases” page, IMO. I would not expect a 2D image to inherently show up on a 3D display; otherwise, what would the point be? Maybe your mindset is more indicative of the general population, but I do think most people understand that 3D holograms and 2D photos are different and would not expect a photo to suddenly have 3D properties on the display as if by magic (perhaps that is hoping too much though).
  - OliverM 5y ago
    I don't have the expectation that putting 2D photos onto a 3D would magically work. I expect to need to convert them (it's a bit much to assume that I would think otherwise). I don't expect to have to buy credits to convert them. There's no mention that I need to, until you get to the extras page when you go to purchase. That changes the entire set of assumptions I had (from "I can play with this and use it to explore whatever I find interesting", to "I have to pay to use it in a way they dictate"). Since then I've found that you probably don't need to do that. But that's not the impression that 'extra' gives. They don't mention anywhere that you don't need the credits to do the conversion.
    - rtkwe 5y ago