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> that is something you still cannot do Factually wrong. You can run apps on iOS without jailbreaking that weren’t approved by Apple, or even ones banned by Ap

> that is something you still cannot do Factually wrong. You can run apps on iOS without jailbreaking that weren’t approved by Apple, or even ones banned by Apple. This has been true for years. Yes, the required resigning of the app every seven days is a major hindrance, but it is still something you very much CAN do.

dpedu 5y ago
That's true but becoming a developer is outside what's being discussed here. Non-developers jailbreak too. Let alone the extra expense and equipment besides the phone itself you're going to need.
- jsjohnst 5y ago
  > That's true but becoming a developer is outside what's being discussed here. Pure anecdata, but the vast majority of folks I see talking about AltStore outside HN are not developers. YMMV!
techrat 5y ago
A temporary cert only able to be created on another Apple system is not what I would say is an 'allowing' of running third party apps. It is a kludge designed to make the process as unpleasant as possible but just so enough that Apple can claim they don't block sideloading. It's disingenuous.
- jsjohnst 5y ago
  > A temporary cert only able to be created on another Apple system You don’t need an Apple system to codesign. Two results on first page of search results: https://github.com/zhlynn/zsign https://github.com/zhlynn/zsign https://weisser-zwerg.dev/posts/ios-app-without-mac/ https://weisser-zwerg.dev/posts/ios-app-without-mac/ > make the process as unpleasant as possible but just so enough that Apple can claim they don't block sideloading Apple doesn’t claim they don’t block side-loading. Actually I believe they claim the opposite in the Epic case (even though it is possible via a supported process) because it was “necessary to ensure the safety of their user base” or something like that. > It's disingenuous Shifting goal posts from “you can’t” to “you can’t without X” once someone points out the first was factually incorrect is considered disingenuous by many too. (Edit for formatting and provide links)
  - dpedu 5y ago
    > Shifting goal posts from “you can’t” to “you can’t without X” once someone points out the first was factually incorrect is considered disingenuous by many too. First off, you're making a huge assumption here. Second, the only goalpost shifting here is your attempt to pass off complex and temporary workarounds intended for developers as resulting in a device that is somehow the same as jailbroken devices. This is incorrect for the obvious reasons pointed out already. Perhaps you are unfamiliar with jailbreak and didn't know apps installed via jailbreak don't need to be constantly renewed and resigned? Installing apps long term is still something you can't do, as I originally said. Attempting to pass off a lesser solution that doesn't come close to matching what I originally mentioned and pretending it is the same is dishonest and disingenuous.
    - jsjohnst 5y ago
      Please show me where I was wrong in anything I said. I've shown conclusively that your statement quoted above was wrong, nothing you said here says anything other than you are angry and want to lash out. > Perhaps you are unfamiliar with jailbreak Considering I wrote one of the first high traffic'd jailbreaking guides for iOS and have been involved in the JB scene in various capacities (never a key role admittedly) since the very beginning, I'm pretty sure that isn't the case. ;)
      - dpedu 5y ago
        That's pretty easy - please re-read my previous comment as it quite clearly mentions the disconnect you're not picking up: > your attempt to pass off complex and temporary workarounds > apps installed via jailbreak don't need to be constantly renewed and resigned? I'm surprised someone who claims to be involved in the scene so long would overlook such an obvious difference.
        jsjohnst 5y ago
        The continued ad hominem is a clear indication you don’t want to have an honest debate and rather just want to pick a fight, so have a nice day!

dpedu 5y ago

That's true but becoming a developer is outside what's being discussed here. Non-developers jailbreak too. Let alone the extra expense and equipment besides the phone itself you're going to need.

jsjohnst 5y ago
> That's true but becoming a developer is outside what's being discussed here. Pure anecdata, but the vast majority of folks I see talking about AltStore outside HN are not developers. YMMV!

techrat 5y ago

A temporary cert only able to be created on another Apple system is not what I would say is an 'allowing' of running third party apps. It is a kludge designed to make the process as unpleasant as possible but just so enough that Apple can claim they don't block sideloading. It's disingenuous.

jsjohnst 5y ago
> A temporary cert only able to be created on another Apple system You don’t need an Apple system to codesign. Two results on first page of search results: https://github.com/zhlynn/zsign https://github.com/zhlynn/zsign https://weisser-zwerg.dev/posts/ios-app-without-mac/ https://weisser-zwerg.dev/posts/ios-app-without-mac/ > make the process as unpleasant as possible but just so enough that Apple can claim they don't block sideloading Apple doesn’t claim they don’t block side-loading. Actually I believe they claim the opposite in the Epic case (even though it is possible via a supported process) because it was “necessary to ensure the safety of their user base” or something like that. > It's disingenuous Shifting goal posts from “you can’t” to “you can’t without X” once someone points out the first was factually incorrect is considered disingenuous by many too. (Edit for formatting and provide links)
- dpedu 5y ago
  > Shifting goal posts from “you can’t” to “you can’t without X” once someone points out the first was factually incorrect is considered disingenuous by many too. First off, you're making a huge assumption here. Second, the only goalpost shifting here is your attempt to pass off complex and temporary workarounds intended for developers as resulting in a device that is somehow the same as jailbroken devices. This is incorrect for the obvious reasons pointed out already. Perhaps you are unfamiliar with jailbreak and didn't know apps installed via jailbreak don't need to be constantly renewed and resigned? Installing apps long term is still something you can't do, as I originally said. Attempting to pass off a lesser solution that doesn't come close to matching what I originally mentioned and pretending it is the same is dishonest and disingenuous.
  - jsjohnst 5y ago
    Please show me where I was wrong in anything I said. I've shown conclusively that your statement quoted above was wrong, nothing you said here says anything other than you are angry and want to lash out. > Perhaps you are unfamiliar with jailbreak Considering I wrote one of the first high traffic'd jailbreaking guides for iOS and have been involved in the JB scene in various capacities (never a key role admittedly) since the very beginning, I'm pretty sure that isn't the case. ;)
    - dpedu 5y ago
      That's pretty easy - please re-read my previous comment as it quite clearly mentions the disconnect you're not picking up: > your attempt to pass off complex and temporary workarounds > apps installed via jailbreak don't need to be constantly renewed and resigned? I'm surprised someone who claims to be involved in the scene so long would overlook such an obvious difference.
      - jsjohnst 5y ago
        The continued ad hominem is a clear indication you don’t want to have an honest debate and rather just want to pick a fight, so have a nice day!