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> If the total cost of ownership is lower with an EV, you can drag the payments out longer with lower interest financing because the vehicle will last longer.

> If the total cost of ownership is lower with an EV, you can drag the payments out longer with lower interest financing because the vehicle will last longer. An EV is much less convenient than a conventional vehicle, it needs to have a lower CoO just to offset that. Once electric vehicles can charge in comparable times to gas for comparable miles, then we can talk, in the meantime you're gaining lower ownership cost for more hassle (and that's ok, but you cannot double-dip it). > I don't mind an 84 month auto loan at <2% interest That's available on gas vehicles too (and even better interest rates in some cases), largely offsetting whatever edge you're trying to argue. > You might not see $25K EVs, but you'll see used versions around that price with 100k+ miles on them that still drive like they're new Drive like? Yes. Range? Unlikely. Just look at the costs of a full battery module replacement, it would eat up over 50% of that $25K price. Plus the rate of technological advancement may hurt old EVs worse than gas vehicles, because one is advancing more rapidly than the other. I suspect a lot of people care that electric sedans costs almost $15K more than hybrid sedans, and I suspect you'll see sales explode if a "Model 2" that cost $25K~ were ever produced (with a few disclaimers on range, seat capacity, etc).

mason55 5y ago
> An EV is much less convenient than a conventional vehicle Probably not true for a lot of people. I’d hit range limits maybe one or two days a year. In exchange I can have my car “full” all the time. It cuts out a lot of trips to the gas station, which aren’t always convenient.
cptskippy 5y ago
> An EV is much less convenient than a conventional vehicle... Once electric vehicles can charge in comparable times to gas for comparable miles, then we can talk... I wish this argument would just die. It's so ignorant and assine. The convenience is different, not less. I haven't had to stop at a gas station to fuel up either of my cars since Nov 2018. I haven't used a charger outside of my home since last August to charge my Nissan Leaf, and in 2020 I only used chargers twice. That's 2 times since Nov of 2019 on a vehicle with an 80 mile range. Our Model 3 was driven across country and kept time with a box truck moving all of our belongings. I plug my cars in when I need a charge at home. I don't have to run out for gas the night before a trip or on the way. I don't have to make planned or unplanned stops at gas stations. I don't have to go to gas stations at all. But EVs are less convenient because you can imagine scenarios in your head.
Smashure 5y ago
As someone who owns an EV and an ICE I’m not sure where you’re getting ICE being more convenient. Ymmv buy in my experience my EV is way more convenient
mikestew 5y ago
An EV is much less convenient than a conventional vehicle Your statement is laughably inaccurate, and sounds to me to support a narrative more than being based on personal experience. I fill the "tank" on the Leaf when I sleep, instead of going out of my way to find a gas station when I drive the ICE. And this is first-get Leaf, which is a loooong way from what more modern BEVs offer. I'm also reminded that I have to go get the oil changed on that Scion xB soon; how convenient. Look, you don't want a BEV, don't buy one. You don't want to buy TSLA, don't buy the stock. What you don't get to do is just make shit up, like this statement: Just look at the costs of a full battery module replacement, it would eat up over 50% of that $25K price. I've looked. Your numbers aren't even close to reality.
sliken 5y ago
When's the last time you drove more than 300 miles in a day? I drove from Sacramento to Denver in a model 3, no big deal, we averaged 200 miles per stop, and often I could often stop a bit short, or a bit long depending on random preferences. Do you often drive 6 hours without a bathroom or food break? Our average stop was between 20 and 30 minutes, when the battery is low it charges at 550 miles an hour or so, and we often just need 200 or so. That way we stop every 3 hours to stretch our legs, let the dog go potty, and let anyone hungry get a snack. Sure, maybe sometimes we would have left 10 minutes sooner. But then again in the last year I've gone to a gas station zero times, taken my car in for an oil change zero times, had zero issues with spark plugs, timing chains, head gaskets, etc. I very rarely drive more than 300 miles a day, so just waking up in the morning to a full car is quite a convenience. Recently I was a bit worried about range, drove to the top of a 14,000+ mountain and was at 51% at the top, after starting with 90% (the Tesla recommended maximum for normal daily driving). I got home with 72%, which I found pretty amazing, the wonders of regenerative braking. So I'd rank an EV for normal usage (commuting less than 300 miles a day) SIGNIFICANTLY more convenient than a gas car.

mason55 5y ago

> An EV is much less convenient than a conventional vehicle Probably not true for a lot of people. I’d hit range limits maybe one or two days a year. In exchange I can have my car “full” all the time. It cuts out a lot of trips to the gas station, which aren’t always convenient.

cptskippy 5y ago

> An EV is much less convenient than a conventional vehicle... Once electric vehicles can charge in comparable times to gas for comparable miles, then we can talk... I wish this argument would just die. It's so ignorant and assine. The convenience is different, not less. I haven't had to stop at a gas station to fuel up either of my cars since Nov 2018. I haven't used a charger outside of my home since last August to charge my Nissan Leaf, and in 2020 I only used chargers twice. That's 2 times since Nov of 2019 on a vehicle with an 80 mile range. Our Model 3 was driven across country and kept time with a box truck moving all of our belongings. I plug my cars in when I need a charge at home. I don't have to run out for gas the night before a trip or on the way. I don't have to make planned or unplanned stops at gas stations. I don't have to go to gas stations at all. But EVs are less convenient because you can imagine scenarios in your head.

Smashure 5y ago

As someone who owns an EV and an ICE I’m not sure where you’re getting ICE being more convenient. Ymmv buy in my experience my EV is way more convenient

mikestew 5y ago

An EV is much less convenient than a conventional vehicle Your statement is laughably inaccurate, and sounds to me to support a narrative more than being based on personal experience. I fill the "tank" on the Leaf when I sleep, instead of going out of my way to find a gas station when I drive the ICE. And this is first-get Leaf, which is a loooong way from what more modern BEVs offer. I'm also reminded that I have to go get the oil changed on that Scion xB soon; how convenient. Look, you don't want a BEV, don't buy one. You don't want to buy TSLA, don't buy the stock. What you don't get to do is just make shit up, like this statement: Just look at the costs of a full battery module replacement, it would eat up over 50% of that $25K price. I've looked. Your numbers aren't even close to reality.

sliken 5y ago

When's the last time you drove more than 300 miles in a day? I drove from Sacramento to Denver in a model 3, no big deal, we averaged 200 miles per stop, and often I could often stop a bit short, or a bit long depending on random preferences. Do you often drive 6 hours without a bathroom or food break? Our average stop was between 20 and 30 minutes, when the battery is low it charges at 550 miles an hour or so, and we often just need 200 or so. That way we stop every 3 hours to stretch our legs, let the dog go potty, and let anyone hungry get a snack. Sure, maybe sometimes we would have left 10 minutes sooner. But then again in the last year I've gone to a gas station zero times, taken my car in for an oil change zero times, had zero issues with spark plugs, timing chains, head gaskets, etc. I very rarely drive more than 300 miles a day, so just waking up in the morning to a full car is quite a convenience. Recently I was a bit worried about range, drove to the top of a 14,000+ mountain and was at 51% at the top, after starting with 90% (the Tesla recommended maximum for normal daily driving). I got home with 72%, which I found pretty amazing, the wonders of regenerative braking. So I'd rank an EV for normal usage (commuting less than 300 miles a day) SIGNIFICANTLY more convenient than a gas car.