4 ms·

Windows is the dominant operating system, and as such has a giant target on its back. It's true, I despise Windows, but the risk of torrenting on Linux vs the r

Windows is the dominant operating system, and as such has a giant target on its back. It's true, I despise Windows, but the risk of torrenting on Linux vs the risk of torrenting on Windows is quite a huge difference. And look, Microsoft has been user-hostile for years now, the fact is, this kind of behavior from them doesn't surprise me anymore, and I'm tired of watching people take those punches lying down.

AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
Windows is definitely more user-hostile than it has been in the past, and seems to be becoming more so[0], but honestly I'll still take Windows over a Linux Desktop any day because it works in a way that is much more in line with how I want my computer to work. Your attitude seems to very much be "you're an idiot for still using Windows and Linux is great", which is condescending as hell. [0] I am by no means defending this behavior. In fact, I hate it and kinda want to beat certain people at Microsoft with a rubber hose over it.
- Subsentient 5y ago
  Ahh, well no. I don't think Windows users are idiots. I think they're normal, non-technical people who don't want to drop to a terminal to pair their bluetooth earbuds because the BlueZ GUI was written in an afternoon by some rando and never worked right. But I do admit that for programmers, I don't understand why they'd want to still use Windows. I mean obviously there's reasons, but they're totally beyond me. Seems like masochism.
  - AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
    And using Linux Desktop seems like masochism to me. Why would I want to use an OS where I can't install applications to a different disk without recompiling them or otherwise jumping through a bunch of namespacing and filesystem overlay hoops? There are reasons people make the choices they do and to assume that just because those reasons are beyond you that they are not reasonable is silly.
  - l30n4da5 5y ago
    > non-technical people who don't want to drop to a terminal PowerShell exists. and it is LEAPS AND BOUNDS better than bash for pretty much anything related to scripting. so much so that half the time when I needed to write a script on linux, I opted to write it in ruby because bash is just that bad to write anything meaningful with. To assume that people on windows don't use a terminal is STILL coming across as condescending as hell. > But I do admit that for programmers, I don't understand why they'd want to still use Windows. there is an entire development ecosystem built around windows that has been around for decades. Only recently (relatively speaking) has it started to branch out and be OS-agnostic. Are you actually saying you didn't know .NET Framework existed, or are you just being willfully ignorant? I used Linux for years as my daily driver OS. Eventually got fed up with it. Driver support for a lot of USB devices is atrocious, and support for HiDpi monitors was still in its infancy when i switched. these are problems that Windows has fixed _right now_ and I don't get paid to fuck with my desktop settings so I can make my monitor display things correctly. I switched to windows, and if I need anything from linux, there is always the WSL, which is pretty much the best of both worlds for me.
jodrellblank 5y ago
> "and look, Microsoft has been user-hostile for years now" You know how sometimes people can have things completely backwards, and it's impossible to understand how? This is one of those times. Windows: the best thing for accessibility, screen readers, keyboard navigation. The best user-side (rather than admin side) automation of programs using things like Autohotkey and COM automation. Windows defender is a response to protect users both from malware and from the predatory behaviour of the likes of McAfee. Enormous amounts invested in hardware compatibility, software backwards compatibility. Generally very good tooling for introspection, performance monitoring, debugging, development on .NET, event tracing, public symbol servers. Famous for GUI wizards making complex tasks possible with less skill. Most typical programs have a next->next->finish install including technical programs like WireShark, Python, etc. "user hostile". Linux world: a culture where the user should "RTFM", where lack of technical skill is mocked, where a GUI wizard is scorned as inferior and people who use them shunned, where not wanting to self-host a LAMP stack is considered "lazy and incompetent", where technology being difficult is seen as par for the course and people who deal with that are lauded for it, where simple things are complex and common things in Windows land are dismissed with "nobody does that" cluelessness accepted without question. It's like seeing a billion people walk into shops, exchange money for food, and leave in 5 minutes and hearing someone living on a homestead who works 5am-10pm pickling cabbage and making the vinegar to do so describing shops as "user hostile" because you can't choose the pressure the grapes were crushed with - the tyrants! Windows is nice. It's incredible to think that you can go to Add/Remove Programs and switch on a type-1 hypervisor with a checkbox click and a reboot (or with a command line if you want) and that's the kind of engineering which runs through Windows, and people dismiss it because of Candy Crush in the start menu (and Microsoft ruin it with candy crush in the start menu).
- l30n4da5 5y ago
  you hit the nail on the head.

AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago

Windows is definitely more user-hostile than it has been in the past, and seems to be becoming more so[0], but honestly I'll still take Windows over a Linux Desktop any day because it works in a way that is much more in line with how I want my computer to work. Your attitude seems to very much be "you're an idiot for still using Windows and Linux is great", which is condescending as hell. [0] I am by no means defending this behavior. In fact, I hate it and kinda want to beat certain people at Microsoft with a rubber hose over it.

Subsentient 5y ago
Ahh, well no. I don't think Windows users are idiots. I think they're normal, non-technical people who don't want to drop to a terminal to pair their bluetooth earbuds because the BlueZ GUI was written in an afternoon by some rando and never worked right. But I do admit that for programmers, I don't understand why they'd want to still use Windows. I mean obviously there's reasons, but they're totally beyond me. Seems like masochism.
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
  And using Linux Desktop seems like masochism to me. Why would I want to use an OS where I can't install applications to a different disk without recompiling them or otherwise jumping through a bunch of namespacing and filesystem overlay hoops? There are reasons people make the choices they do and to assume that just because those reasons are beyond you that they are not reasonable is silly.
- l30n4da5 5y ago
  > non-technical people who don't want to drop to a terminal PowerShell exists. and it is LEAPS AND BOUNDS better than bash for pretty much anything related to scripting. so much so that half the time when I needed to write a script on linux, I opted to write it in ruby because bash is just that bad to write anything meaningful with. To assume that people on windows don't use a terminal is STILL coming across as condescending as hell. > But I do admit that for programmers, I don't understand why they'd want to still use Windows. there is an entire development ecosystem built around windows that has been around for decades. Only recently (relatively speaking) has it started to branch out and be OS-agnostic. Are you actually saying you didn't know .NET Framework existed, or are you just being willfully ignorant? I used Linux for years as my daily driver OS. Eventually got fed up with it. Driver support for a lot of USB devices is atrocious, and support for HiDpi monitors was still in its infancy when i switched. these are problems that Windows has fixed _right now_ and I don't get paid to fuck with my desktop settings so I can make my monitor display things correctly. I switched to windows, and if I need anything from linux, there is always the WSL, which is pretty much the best of both worlds for me.

jodrellblank 5y ago

> "and look, Microsoft has been user-hostile for years now" You know how sometimes people can have things completely backwards, and it's impossible to understand how? This is one of those times. Windows: the best thing for accessibility, screen readers, keyboard navigation. The best user-side (rather than admin side) automation of programs using things like Autohotkey and COM automation. Windows defender is a response to protect users both from malware and from the predatory behaviour of the likes of McAfee. Enormous amounts invested in hardware compatibility, software backwards compatibility. Generally very good tooling for introspection, performance monitoring, debugging, development on .NET, event tracing, public symbol servers. Famous for GUI wizards making complex tasks possible with less skill. Most typical programs have a next->next->finish install including technical programs like WireShark, Python, etc. "user hostile". Linux world: a culture where the user should "RTFM", where lack of technical skill is mocked, where a GUI wizard is scorned as inferior and people who use them shunned, where not wanting to self-host a LAMP stack is considered "lazy and incompetent", where technology being difficult is seen as par for the course and people who deal with that are lauded for it, where simple things are complex and common things in Windows land are dismissed with "nobody does that" cluelessness accepted without question. It's like seeing a billion people walk into shops, exchange money for food, and leave in 5 minutes and hearing someone living on a homestead who works 5am-10pm pickling cabbage and making the vinegar to do so describing shops as "user hostile" because you can't choose the pressure the grapes were crushed with - the tyrants! Windows is nice. It's incredible to think that you can go to Add/Remove Programs and switch on a type-1 hypervisor with a checkbox click and a reboot (or with a command line if you want) and that's the kind of engineering which runs through Windows, and people dismiss it because of Candy Crush in the start menu (and Microsoft ruin it with candy crush in the start menu).

l30n4da5 5y ago
you hit the nail on the head.