4 ms·

That is not true. If you're vaccinated you have the same chance of getting infected whether the person you're talking to is vaccinated or not, within miniscule

That is not true. If you're vaccinated you have the same chance of getting infected whether the person you're talking to is vaccinated or not, within miniscule margins of error. If we're going to argue about the miniscule margins of error then you might as well ban pharmaceutical medications as well because there's always a chance of adverse side effects.

SideburnsOfDoom 5y ago
Sorry, I disagree. Do not oversimplify. My case is: An unvaccinated person is more likely to be infected, and more likely to shed lots of virus if infected. Vaccinated people can become infected, albeit at a lower rate, therefor being around infected people is not safe, even if vaccinated. This is clearly a mainstream opinion, as masks are still recommended, even for vaccinated people, in many contexts. None of these risks are "miniscule". This diagram might help you understand the basics https://i.redd.it/km870p4xn1d71.jpg https://i.redd.it/km870p4xn1d71.jpg Citation needed for your case.
- nickthemagicman 5y ago
  Wow I didn't realize how terrible the vaccine was from that diagram you posted! I thought it was equivalent to Polio or MMR. You know what's close to 100% effective? The natural immune system. Efficacy of the immune system is close to 100% in healthy young populations. 30,000 /34 million infected https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-from-covid-by-age-us/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-... Another solution instead of forcing people to take a that useless experimental vaccine...is keeping old unhealthy people on quarantine forever. And allowing the 90% of the population who are below 60 and healthy to live their lives.
  - SideburnsOfDoom 5y ago
    > You know what's close to 100% effective? The natural immune system. I think you're saying that recovery from infection provides better immune response than a vaccine. This is flatly false: https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/articles/why-covid-19-vaccines-offer-better-protection-than-infection.html https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/articles/why-covid-19-vaccine... re-infection does happen too. > useless experimental vaccine The various COVID vaccines are not in any way useless. Current double digit daily mortality figures in the UK, with the same number of cases same as January, which had high three digit mortality figures, demonstrate this starkly. Do not reduce it to binary yes/no thinking. COVID vaccines are _neither_ perfect, not useless. You are a disinformation vector. We are the worse for your presence in this conversation.
    - nickthemagicman 5y ago
      You posted an OPINION piece as a citation? And you call me false information? You better learn what VALID citations are before you call ANYTHING false information. You manipulate with incomplete truths and poor statistics. You're a fear vector. People like you are what hundreds of thousands of people in Paris are protesting. Things are not going to end well for people like you. https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/protesters-against-covid-restrictions-clash-with-police-paris-bfm-television-2021-07-24/ https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/protesters-against-covi... I would like you to read this and attempt to understand it: If the vaccine has an improvement in 70% of hospitalizations, like demonstrated in your diagram. (34,000 fatal / 34 million infected) = 0.001 percent chance of fatality in the under 50 age group who are unvaccinated. Now...you're talking about .07 of .001 percent improvement in outcomes. That's insanely small percentage of an insanely small number. You want people under 50 to get an experimental vaccine for that? Apparently the natural immune system is working well enough.
      - SideburnsOfDoom 5y ago
        That's not my diagram it, comes from the Financial Times of London > If the vaccine has an improvement in 70% of hospitalizations, You have misread the diagram. Multiply the first filter (80% against infection) by the second ( 70% against hospitalizations) Fatality is _not_ the only very unpleasant outcome that can occur, your characterisation of the vaccines as experimental is increasingly false, and you ignore the way that vaccinating people prevents disease in others around them. > Things are not going to end well for people like you. Should I report your threat then?
        nickthemagicman 5y ago
        > Should I report your threat then? You should report Human History. You will be shown to be wrong, much like the people who unscientifically argued against Galileo...using the biggest opinion piece of all: the bible. I'm talking with a person who posts OPINION pieces as CITATIONS but the mods won't flag your false information. This is a pointless conversation. > You have misread the diagram. It doesn't matter what you multiply a miniscule number by. We don't wear motorcycle helmets while driving to reduce the risk of car accident fatalities because it's already an incredibly small number.

SideburnsOfDoom 5y ago

Sorry, I disagree. Do not oversimplify. My case is: An unvaccinated person is more likely to be infected, and more likely to shed lots of virus if infected. Vaccinated people can become infected, albeit at a lower rate, therefor being around infected people is not safe, even if vaccinated. This is clearly a mainstream opinion, as masks are still recommended, even for vaccinated people, in many contexts. None of these risks are "miniscule". This diagram might help you understand the basics https://i.redd.it/km870p4xn1d71.jpg https://i.redd.it/km870p4xn1d71.jpg Citation needed for your case.

nickthemagicman 5y ago
Wow I didn't realize how terrible the vaccine was from that diagram you posted! I thought it was equivalent to Polio or MMR. You know what's close to 100% effective? The natural immune system. Efficacy of the immune system is close to 100% in healthy young populations. 30,000 /34 million infected https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-from-covid-by-age-us/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/1191568/reported-deaths-... Another solution instead of forcing people to take a that useless experimental vaccine...is keeping old unhealthy people on quarantine forever. And allowing the 90% of the population who are below 60 and healthy to live their lives.
- SideburnsOfDoom 5y ago
  > You know what's close to 100% effective? The natural immune system. I think you're saying that recovery from infection provides better immune response than a vaccine. This is flatly false: https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/articles/why-covid-19-vaccines-offer-better-protection-than-infection.html https://www.jhsph.edu/covid-19/articles/why-covid-19-vaccine... re-infection does happen too. > useless experimental vaccine The various COVID vaccines are not in any way useless. Current double digit daily mortality figures in the UK, with the same number of cases same as January, which had high three digit mortality figures, demonstrate this starkly. Do not reduce it to binary yes/no thinking. COVID vaccines are _neither_ perfect, not useless. You are a disinformation vector. We are the worse for your presence in this conversation.
  - nickthemagicman 5y ago
    You posted an OPINION piece as a citation? And you call me false information? You better learn what VALID citations are before you call ANYTHING false information. You manipulate with incomplete truths and poor statistics. You're a fear vector. People like you are what hundreds of thousands of people in Paris are protesting. Things are not going to end well for people like you. https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/protesters-against-covid-restrictions-clash-with-police-paris-bfm-television-2021-07-24/ https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/protesters-against-covi... I would like you to read this and attempt to understand it: If the vaccine has an improvement in 70% of hospitalizations, like demonstrated in your diagram. (34,000 fatal / 34 million infected) = 0.001 percent chance of fatality in the under 50 age group who are unvaccinated. Now...you're talking about .07 of .001 percent improvement in outcomes. That's insanely small percentage of an insanely small number. You want people under 50 to get an experimental vaccine for that? Apparently the natural immune system is working well enough.
    - SideburnsOfDoom 5y ago
      That's not my diagram it, comes from the Financial Times of London > If the vaccine has an improvement in 70% of hospitalizations, You have misread the diagram. Multiply the first filter (80% against infection) by the second ( 70% against hospitalizations) Fatality is _not_ the only very unpleasant outcome that can occur, your characterisation of the vaccines as experimental is increasingly false, and you ignore the way that vaccinating people prevents disease in others around them. > Things are not going to end well for people like you. Should I report your threat then?
      - nickthemagicman 5y ago
        > Should I report your threat then? You should report Human History. You will be shown to be wrong, much like the people who unscientifically argued against Galileo...using the biggest opinion piece of all: the bible. I'm talking with a person who posts OPINION pieces as CITATIONS but the mods won't flag your false information. This is a pointless conversation. > You have misread the diagram. It doesn't matter what you multiply a miniscule number by. We don't wear motorcycle helmets while driving to reduce the risk of car accident fatalities because it's already an incredibly small number.