5 ms·

I don't know where you live, but where I live, most software engineers are easily in the top 10% of income. Sure, you can chase $200k FAANG jobs in SV and go th

I don't know where you live, but where I live, most software engineers are easily in the top 10% of income. Sure, you can chase $200k FAANG jobs in SV and go through all the misery that is associated with that, and then spend 50% on housing and living costs, or you can make a comfortable $130k here with free healthcare, education and so on, drive a Tesla and own a big house.

fuzzylama 5y ago
what country may that be?
alangibson 5y ago
Austrian transplant here. Yea, we're top earners, but salaries in generally not high. We get the majority of our compensation in vacation, social insurance, pension, etc. 130K would put you in the 50% tax bracket here. So you'd get 14 (no, seriously) paychecks of 4642. Not bad to be sure, but not exactly space tourist money either.
- ChuckNorris89 5y ago
  Another Austrian here. 130k IC dev jobs are pretty much unheard of here. Most senior roles top out at around 80k-90k here and they're definitely not stress free as you're expected to deliver outstanding results at that pay grade and have a high availability, plus, most come with the bullshit "all-in" contracts (basically you wave your rights to paid overtime). That's why there's a dev shortage here since most Austrians avoid these jobs and move instead to management/consulting/finance where pay is better for less stress as those jobs are much higher up the pecking order when it comes to money and status in the company while devs are seen as replaceable cogs. While the standard of living is good here with decent social services, Austria is definitely not a good market for devs. Maybe better than places like Italy/Spain/Portugal but worse than the other major tech hubs in Europe, including places in Eastern Europe like Bucharest or Warsaw when you factor in the brutal taxes and high CoL in Austria.
  - alangibson 5y ago
    Agreed. AFAIK, I've never met a dev making 6 figures in Austria. I was in the highest technical software position at a name brand company, working in the state capitol city, and I was making like 8OK.
- IceDane 5y ago
  I live in Denmark. The limit for the top tax bracket here is about $86k, after which you pay 15% of the difference between your salary and the top tax bracket limit. The average salary for a software developer in Denmark is around $80k, but $100k+ salaries are pretty common, and at my company the ceiling is about $130k.
- jogjayr 5y ago
  > 130K would put you in the 50% tax bracket here Is the term "tax bracket" used differently outside of the US/Canada? Here it means your marginal tax rate (i.e. the highest rate at which your last dollar is taxed). Whereas you seem to be speaking about "effective tax rate" - that's total tax paid / gross income.
ChuckNorris89 5y ago
In which country and company in Europe can devs get "a comfortable 130k"?
- debarshri 5y ago
  In netherlands, you can earn a comfortable 130k.
  - ChuckNorris89 5y ago
    Is that 130k rally that comfortable to get in the Netherlands? Since most local dutch companies pay around 50k with salaries of 130k coming only from US companies in Amsterdam like Uber which have the same brutal leet-code practices from SV that grandparent said aren't necessarily. If all devs in the Netherlands could get 130k so comfortably then how would those Dutch companies paying only 50k still survive and not go bust?
    - debarshri 5y ago
      How about working as a contractor earning 75 euros per hour?
      - ChuckNorris89 5y ago
        That didn't answer my question.
        debarshri 5y ago
        There are multiple reason why they might survive. There market might be local, which many of the companies from US do not serve. What I have also seen, companies that pay low hire people with non-cs background, people looking for career change, people without experience but with motivation. When I said comfortable, in this context it meant. A job that pays 130k and still is not stressful and you can have a comfortable lifestyle. I did not mean that you can easily get a 130k job.
  - 5y ago
whatever_dude 5y ago
Countries have different costs of living. It's like a different scale. X in some_european_country gives you a quality of life as if you made 4X in the US. But if you move back to the US that is lost since the scale doesn't apply anymore. The American pursuit for the highest salary possible is blinding people to what actually means living well.
- 908B64B197 5y ago
  I keep hearing CoL but what's never discussed is assets and equity. Sure, houses cost more in the Bay Area, but then when you sell the house you get more money. Meaning you can then retire in a low CoL place. But someone selling his cheaper house can't decide to retire in the Bay Area.

fuzzylama 5y ago

what country may that be?

alangibson 5y ago

Austrian transplant here. Yea, we're top earners, but salaries in generally not high. We get the majority of our compensation in vacation, social insurance, pension, etc. 130K would put you in the 50% tax bracket here. So you'd get 14 (no, seriously) paychecks of 4642. Not bad to be sure, but not exactly space tourist money either.

ChuckNorris89 5y ago
Another Austrian here. 130k IC dev jobs are pretty much unheard of here. Most senior roles top out at around 80k-90k here and they're definitely not stress free as you're expected to deliver outstanding results at that pay grade and have a high availability, plus, most come with the bullshit "all-in" contracts (basically you wave your rights to paid overtime). That's why there's a dev shortage here since most Austrians avoid these jobs and move instead to management/consulting/finance where pay is better for less stress as those jobs are much higher up the pecking order when it comes to money and status in the company while devs are seen as replaceable cogs. While the standard of living is good here with decent social services, Austria is definitely not a good market for devs. Maybe better than places like Italy/Spain/Portugal but worse than the other major tech hubs in Europe, including places in Eastern Europe like Bucharest or Warsaw when you factor in the brutal taxes and high CoL in Austria.
- alangibson 5y ago
  Agreed. AFAIK, I've never met a dev making 6 figures in Austria. I was in the highest technical software position at a name brand company, working in the state capitol city, and I was making like 8OK.
IceDane 5y ago
I live in Denmark. The limit for the top tax bracket here is about $86k, after which you pay 15% of the difference between your salary and the top tax bracket limit. The average salary for a software developer in Denmark is around $80k, but $100k+ salaries are pretty common, and at my company the ceiling is about $130k.
jogjayr 5y ago
> 130K would put you in the 50% tax bracket here Is the term "tax bracket" used differently outside of the US/Canada? Here it means your marginal tax rate (i.e. the highest rate at which your last dollar is taxed). Whereas you seem to be speaking about "effective tax rate" - that's total tax paid / gross income.

ChuckNorris89 5y ago

In which country and company in Europe can devs get "a comfortable 130k"?

debarshri 5y ago
In netherlands, you can earn a comfortable 130k.
- ChuckNorris89 5y ago
  Is that 130k rally that comfortable to get in the Netherlands? Since most local dutch companies pay around 50k with salaries of 130k coming only from US companies in Amsterdam like Uber which have the same brutal leet-code practices from SV that grandparent said aren't necessarily. If all devs in the Netherlands could get 130k so comfortably then how would those Dutch companies paying only 50k still survive and not go bust?
  - debarshri 5y ago
    How about working as a contractor earning 75 euros per hour?
    - ChuckNorris89 5y ago
      That didn't answer my question.
      - debarshri 5y ago
        There are multiple reason why they might survive. There market might be local, which many of the companies from US do not serve. What I have also seen, companies that pay low hire people with non-cs background, people looking for career change, people without experience but with motivation. When I said comfortable, in this context it meant. A job that pays 130k and still is not stressful and you can have a comfortable lifestyle. I did not mean that you can easily get a 130k job.
- 5y ago

whatever_dude 5y ago

Countries have different costs of living. It's like a different scale. X in some_european_country gives you a quality of life as if you made 4X in the US. But if you move back to the US that is lost since the scale doesn't apply anymore. The American pursuit for the highest salary possible is blinding people to what actually means living well.

908B64B197 5y ago
I keep hearing CoL but what's never discussed is assets and equity. Sure, houses cost more in the Bay Area, but then when you sell the house you get more money. Meaning you can then retire in a low CoL place. But someone selling his cheaper house can't decide to retire in the Bay Area.