8 ms·

> First, if you can remember only 3 things: > Zh is like a J sound (as in "Jam") > X is like a Sh sound (as in "Shot") > Q is like a Ch sound (as in "China")

> First, if you can remember only 3 things: > Zh is like a J sound (as in "Jam") > X is like a Sh sound (as in "Shot") > Q is like a Ch sound (as in "China") This is very useful to know, but I have a question. When converting the original characters into English, why didn't the creators of this system choose letters which more closely match the native pronunciation? For example, why "Qi" instead of "Chi"?

paradite 5y ago
Native Chinese speaker (though not linguist) here. For "q" and "ch", both are valid pinyin. "ch" in pinyin is actually the same as "ch" in English in terms of pronunciation. "q" in pinyin doesn't have a equivalent in English so it is just "q", which is similar to "q" but not really.
- tralarpa 5y ago
  It was explained to me that the difference between "q" and "ch" (and the same for "j" and "zh") is the position of the tongue, that is it is rolled back in "ch" and "zh". Correct?
  - paradite 5y ago
    That is correct. However it's quite hard to describe how to pronounce it exactly in words. I guess it comes from hearing it and practicing it.
GordonS 5y ago
Basic-level Mandarin speaker here, but well-versed in Pinyin. There are actually kind of 2 "sh" sounds and 2 "ch" sounds in Mandarin. "Sh" is a "heavy" sound, as in "shot", where your mouth makes an O shape, whereas "X" is a much "lighter" sound that AI don't believe has a comparison in English. Similarly, "Ch" is a "heavy" sound, and "q" is much lighter sound.
bmn__ 5y ago
> When converting the original characters into English Latin characters is correct, not English > why didn't the creators of this system choose letters which more closely match the native pronunciation? Because among other things the designers of Pīnyīn wanted the users to be able to type the letters on commonly available typewriters (in the 1950s). A 100% match is of course the IPA, but that was exceedingly difficult to type until late after the advent of personal computers. Pīnyīn is a compromise. Compare: tɕʰiː˥˩ · qì ʈʂʰɻ̩˥ · chī

paradite 5y ago

Native Chinese speaker (though not linguist) here. For "q" and "ch", both are valid pinyin. "ch" in pinyin is actually the same as "ch" in English in terms of pronunciation. "q" in pinyin doesn't have a equivalent in English so it is just "q", which is similar to "q" but not really.

tralarpa 5y ago
It was explained to me that the difference between "q" and "ch" (and the same for "j" and "zh") is the position of the tongue, that is it is rolled back in "ch" and "zh". Correct?
- paradite 5y ago
  That is correct. However it's quite hard to describe how to pronounce it exactly in words. I guess it comes from hearing it and practicing it.

GordonS 5y ago

Basic-level Mandarin speaker here, but well-versed in Pinyin. There are actually kind of 2 "sh" sounds and 2 "ch" sounds in Mandarin. "Sh" is a "heavy" sound, as in "shot", where your mouth makes an O shape, whereas "X" is a much "lighter" sound that AI don't believe has a comparison in English. Similarly, "Ch" is a "heavy" sound, and "q" is much lighter sound.

bmn__ 5y ago

> When converting the original characters into English Latin characters is correct, not English > why didn't the creators of this system choose letters which more closely match the native pronunciation? Because among other things the designers of Pīnyīn wanted the users to be able to type the letters on commonly available typewriters (in the 1950s). A 100% match is of course the IPA, but that was exceedingly difficult to type until late after the advent of personal computers. Pīnyīn is a compromise. Compare: tɕʰiː˥˩ · qì ʈʂʰɻ̩˥ · chī