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I think people would be much healthier if we allowed the night to be dark. Personally I sleep much better in darkness. I don’t really understand why everything

I think people would be much healthier if we allowed the night to be dark. Personally I sleep much better in darkness. I don’t really understand why everything needs to be lit up at night.

deadA1ias 5y ago
Presumably there is perceived safety, both from crime and when operating a vehicle. Whether the data confirms this or not is unknown (to me).
- throw0101a 5y ago
  Bad lighting can actually make things worse because of (blinding) glare and shadows: * https://www.darksky.org/light-pollution/lighting-crime-and-safety/ https://www.darksky.org/light-pollution/lighting-crime-and-s... Proper lighting does seem to help reduce crime: * https://urbanlabs.uchicago.edu/projects/crime-lights-study https://urbanlabs.uchicago.edu/projects/crime-lights-study * https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/2019/5/9/how-something-as-small-as-street-lights-can-reduce-crime https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/2019/5/9/how-something-a... Study is ongoing: * https://theconversation.com/the-science-of-street-lights-what-makes-people-feel-safe-at-night-103805 https://theconversation.com/the-science-of-street-lights-wha... I'm curious to know if motion sensors can be used to turn off lights when people aren't around, but switch things on as they're in the area, and a few lights down the street as well so they can see what's up ahead. I doubt there's many folks around between (say) midnight and 5, and so some energy could be saved.
  - nutedi 5y ago
    This would make things worse on streets that have even a moderate amount of traffic (4 people per hour) as lights switching on and off is far more distracting than ones that are on continously.
    - throw0101a 5y ago
      Depends on the settings. Limiting it between midnight and 4 or 5, when there's probably the fewest number of people awake, would be one way to minimize switching. Whether it's a fast on-off or gradual would also probably determine how disruptive it would be. This would also be done mostly in low-traffic areas, and that'd be relatively easy to determine because you'd have motion sensors to measure things. Heuristics could be determined to see traffic patterns: more people are likely to be out late on Friday and Saturday nights than on a random Tuesday at 0300. One experiment found an 80% reduction in electrical use: * https://newatlas.com/motion-sensing-streetlight-system/19199/ https://newatlas.com/motion-sensing-streetlight-system/19199... At the very least a system like this could perhaps be done for parking lots, which generally see little activity in the middle of the night. There's a lot of empty asphalt being lit up now.
Sophistifunk 5y ago
A lot of things are either only possible at all, or a lot safer, with light. A simple example is driving, the more you can see the safer you are. Environmental lighting is a big part of this, particularly in countries with tyrannical policing of anti-modification regulations like Australia or (even more so) Germany. Anecdote: My old Mazda was the top-of-the-line when it was made, the nicest road car you could get from Mazda no matter how much money you had. And the headlights were terrible. Well-lit streets were always noticeably easier to drive at night. I could have replaced them with a HID or LED for less than a thousand dollars, and been much happier and safer, for a week. Then I'd be pulled over, given a defect canary (a fine, a huge sticker on your windshield labelling you to other police to harass, as well a requirement to prove you've "remedied" the situation). Get a few defect notices, and the police can have your car crushed into a cube with no recourse under "anti hoon" laws.
tester34 5y ago
how I'll walk to home when drunk at night without streetlamps? :| damn, those trade offs!

I think people would be much healthier if we allowed the night to be dark. Personally I sleep much better in darkness. I don’t really understand why everything needs to be lit up at night.

deadA1ias 5y ago

Presumably there is perceived safety, both from crime and when operating a vehicle. Whether the data confirms this or not is unknown (to me).

throw0101a 5y ago
Bad lighting can actually make things worse because of (blinding) glare and shadows: * https://www.darksky.org/light-pollution/lighting-crime-and-safety/ https://www.darksky.org/light-pollution/lighting-crime-and-s... Proper lighting does seem to help reduce crime: * https://urbanlabs.uchicago.edu/projects/crime-lights-study https://urbanlabs.uchicago.edu/projects/crime-lights-study * https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/2019/5/9/how-something-as-small-as-street-lights-can-reduce-crime https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/2019/5/9/how-something-a... Study is ongoing: * https://theconversation.com/the-science-of-street-lights-what-makes-people-feel-safe-at-night-103805 https://theconversation.com/the-science-of-street-lights-wha... I'm curious to know if motion sensors can be used to turn off lights when people aren't around, but switch things on as they're in the area, and a few lights down the street as well so they can see what's up ahead. I doubt there's many folks around between (say) midnight and 5, and so some energy could be saved.
- nutedi 5y ago
  This would make things worse on streets that have even a moderate amount of traffic (4 people per hour) as lights switching on and off is far more distracting than ones that are on continously.
  - throw0101a 5y ago
    Depends on the settings. Limiting it between midnight and 4 or 5, when there's probably the fewest number of people awake, would be one way to minimize switching. Whether it's a fast on-off or gradual would also probably determine how disruptive it would be. This would also be done mostly in low-traffic areas, and that'd be relatively easy to determine because you'd have motion sensors to measure things. Heuristics could be determined to see traffic patterns: more people are likely to be out late on Friday and Saturday nights than on a random Tuesday at 0300. One experiment found an 80% reduction in electrical use: * https://newatlas.com/motion-sensing-streetlight-system/19199/ https://newatlas.com/motion-sensing-streetlight-system/19199... At the very least a system like this could perhaps be done for parking lots, which generally see little activity in the middle of the night. There's a lot of empty asphalt being lit up now.

Sophistifunk 5y ago

A lot of things are either only possible at all, or a lot safer, with light. A simple example is driving, the more you can see the safer you are. Environmental lighting is a big part of this, particularly in countries with tyrannical policing of anti-modification regulations like Australia or (even more so) Germany. Anecdote: My old Mazda was the top-of-the-line when it was made, the nicest road car you could get from Mazda no matter how much money you had. And the headlights were terrible. Well-lit streets were always noticeably easier to drive at night. I could have replaced them with a HID or LED for less than a thousand dollars, and been much happier and safer, for a week. Then I'd be pulled over, given a defect canary (a fine, a huge sticker on your windshield labelling you to other police to harass, as well a requirement to prove you've "remedied" the situation). Get a few defect notices, and the police can have your car crushed into a cube with no recourse under "anti hoon" laws.

tester34 5y ago

how I'll walk to home when drunk at night without streetlamps? :| damn, those trade offs!