5 ms·

Funny, he'd fit more in a hunter-gatherer society because guess what they also don't have... (to spell it out: money). I mostly agree with what you write, but

Funny, he'd fit more in a hunter-gatherer society because guess what they also don't have... (to spell it out: money). I mostly agree with what you write, but "You have to contribute productively" is such a capitalist mindset that it draws for me the picture of you being a Gordon Gekko type. I wonder if he'd agree to do some work like cleaning the city parks in exchange for some "gifted" groceries and a room. Obviously the city doesn't want to enter into customized barters with all its employees.

CydeWeys 5y ago
> Funny, he'd fit more in a hunter-gatherer society because guess what they also don't have... (to spell it out: money). His refusal to use money is really a lampshade on a refusal to do anything useful period. Plenty of people don't interact with money yet still manage to provide useful goods and services in exchange for necessities. He's not doing any of that either. > "You have to contribute productively" is such a capitalist mindset that it draws for me the picture of you being a Gordon Gekko type. You've got me pegged all wrong. This transcends affront to capitalism to affront to all forms of societal organization; guy is a mooch, pure and simple, unwilling to do anything to help others but perfectly willing to accept all help from others for his own benefit. No society would put up with him, capitalistic or otherwise. He's a deadbeat father who wouldn't even do anything to support his own kids. > I wonder if he'd agree to do some work like cleaning the city parks in exchange [...] Based on what I read in the article it doesn't seem like he's willing to do any work at all. No mentions of performing any work or services in exchange for essentials; it's all freely given to him by charitable people and organizations.
- kderbyma 5y ago
  I agree with you. there is nothing to be proud of in his case except that his life doesn't seem to be affected directly by inflation so long as the rest of society keeps its status quo. I like you recognize that capitalism and money are not the same as productivity and value add....he doesn't seem to do the latter but he benefits still from the former because as you said he is a mooch.
- jamincan 5y ago
  He could easily volunteer his time and return some of what he has received in labour, but he doesn't even do that.
dghughes 5y ago
Money exists in other forms other names money is effort and effort is time, your time. Hunter-gatherer societies would have an equivalent of money not literally notes and coins but trading their effort and time. It is literally a society, people gather in a group for mutual advantage. The advantage being I don't want to personally make, build, do everything to survive so you trade skills which is effort and time which is essentially money.
umanwizard 5y ago
> "You have to contribute productively" is such a capitalist mindset No it’s not. All socialist/communist societies required all able-bodied people to work, described themselves as worker-led, and idolized work in their propaganda.
- CydeWeys 5y ago
  Good point. The hammer and sickle aren't implements of leisure, after all. It's really all societies that require capable people to pull their own weight, not just capitalism. Even money-free communes/kibbutzes have chore rotations and expect everyone to pull their own weight regarding necessary tasks like farming, cooking, cleaning, maintenance, child-raising, etc.

CydeWeys 5y ago

> Funny, he'd fit more in a hunter-gatherer society because guess what they also don't have... (to spell it out: money). His refusal to use money is really a lampshade on a refusal to do anything useful period. Plenty of people don't interact with money yet still manage to provide useful goods and services in exchange for necessities. He's not doing any of that either. > "You have to contribute productively" is such a capitalist mindset that it draws for me the picture of you being a Gordon Gekko type. You've got me pegged all wrong. This transcends affront to capitalism to affront to all forms of societal organization; guy is a mooch, pure and simple, unwilling to do anything to help others but perfectly willing to accept all help from others for his own benefit. No society would put up with him, capitalistic or otherwise. He's a deadbeat father who wouldn't even do anything to support his own kids. > I wonder if he'd agree to do some work like cleaning the city parks in exchange [...] Based on what I read in the article it doesn't seem like he's willing to do any work at all. No mentions of performing any work or services in exchange for essentials; it's all freely given to him by charitable people and organizations.

kderbyma 5y ago
I agree with you. there is nothing to be proud of in his case except that his life doesn't seem to be affected directly by inflation so long as the rest of society keeps its status quo. I like you recognize that capitalism and money are not the same as productivity and value add....he doesn't seem to do the latter but he benefits still from the former because as you said he is a mooch.
jamincan 5y ago
He could easily volunteer his time and return some of what he has received in labour, but he doesn't even do that.

dghughes 5y ago

Money exists in other forms other names money is effort and effort is time, your time. Hunter-gatherer societies would have an equivalent of money not literally notes and coins but trading their effort and time. It is literally a society, people gather in a group for mutual advantage. The advantage being I don't want to personally make, build, do everything to survive so you trade skills which is effort and time which is essentially money.

umanwizard 5y ago

> "You have to contribute productively" is such a capitalist mindset No it’s not. All socialist/communist societies required all able-bodied people to work, described themselves as worker-led, and idolized work in their propaganda.

CydeWeys 5y ago
Good point. The hammer and sickle aren't implements of leisure, after all. It's really all societies that require capable people to pull their own weight, not just capitalism. Even money-free communes/kibbutzes have chore rotations and expect everyone to pull their own weight regarding necessary tasks like farming, cooking, cleaning, maintenance, child-raising, etc.