4 ms·

... which is very helpful to have when someone is committing violent crime. I for one am glad there's police presence in my mid size town (61k).

void_mint 5y ago
In this thread we aren't talking about violent crime though. We're talking about mental health.
- TimTheTinker 5y ago
  We're talking about police and their usefulness as well. Preventing and prosecuting violent crime is where police are most indispensable.
actually_a_dog 5y ago
It would be much more helpful if they were obligated to either protect or serve. As it is, they have no obligation to do either one. "To protect and serve" is literally nothing more than a marketing slogan, originally used by the LAPD. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia https://www.lapdonline.org/history_of_the_lapd/content_basic_view/1128 https://www.lapdonline.org/history_of_the_lapd/content_basic...
- TimTheTinker 5y ago
  I think that's partly a false dichotomy. They serve primarily by protecting.
  - actually_a_dog 5y ago
    Which would be great, if they had a duty to protect anybody who wasn't in their custody.
    - TimTheTinker 5y ago
      They do. It may not be a legal duty, but it's a moral duty that I know many police men and women recognize and aspire to.
      - actually_a_dog 5y ago
        Sure. Whatever you say.
betwixthewires 5y ago
I will say the very few times I've needed to call them they helped, a little. One particular case I had to buy my stolen stuff back, I'm lucky they found it, and they of course probably charged the guy who stole it with felony theft. Another case they resolved only after threatening to leave me with my problem unless I let them check my friends for warrants, which none had thankfully, and threatening to shoot me. Other encounters were usually uneventful, sterile and bureaucratic in nature, only once did I have what would be called a positive encounter, the cop declared respect for my rights. He still wrote me a ticket. And there's the countless "interactions" where you just see them around and they don't hassle you at all. All in all, you need someone who's job it is to deter crime and prosecute criminals in some way. But people willing to enforce unjust laws and who have personal incentives to make your life harder and some authority to do that when it pleases them to are not to be trusted. If we could have the former without the latter that would be great. But given that cops can't actually stop crimes unless they get lucky and most crimes go unsolved, and seeing as we have the latter, it's not worth it. It would be better to just encourage people to be armed for their own protection.
alisonkisk 5y ago
Then you should hope they stop being used as fake mental health counselors.

void_mint 5y ago

In this thread we aren't talking about violent crime though. We're talking about mental health.

TimTheTinker 5y ago
We're talking about police and their usefulness as well. Preventing and prosecuting violent crime is where police are most indispensable.

actually_a_dog 5y ago

It would be much more helpful if they were obligated to either protect or serve. As it is, they have no obligation to do either one. "To protect and serve" is literally nothing more than a marketing slogan, originally used by the LAPD. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia https://www.lapdonline.org/history_of_the_lapd/content_basic_view/1128 https://www.lapdonline.org/history_of_the_lapd/content_basic...

TimTheTinker 5y ago
I think that's partly a false dichotomy. They serve primarily by protecting.
- actually_a_dog 5y ago
  Which would be great, if they had a duty to protect anybody who wasn't in their custody.
  - TimTheTinker 5y ago
    They do. It may not be a legal duty, but it's a moral duty that I know many police men and women recognize and aspire to.
    - actually_a_dog 5y ago
      Sure. Whatever you say.

betwixthewires 5y ago

I will say the very few times I've needed to call them they helped, a little. One particular case I had to buy my stolen stuff back, I'm lucky they found it, and they of course probably charged the guy who stole it with felony theft. Another case they resolved only after threatening to leave me with my problem unless I let them check my friends for warrants, which none had thankfully, and threatening to shoot me. Other encounters were usually uneventful, sterile and bureaucratic in nature, only once did I have what would be called a positive encounter, the cop declared respect for my rights. He still wrote me a ticket. And there's the countless "interactions" where you just see them around and they don't hassle you at all. All in all, you need someone who's job it is to deter crime and prosecute criminals in some way. But people willing to enforce unjust laws and who have personal incentives to make your life harder and some authority to do that when it pleases them to are not to be trusted. If we could have the former without the latter that would be great. But given that cops can't actually stop crimes unless they get lucky and most crimes go unsolved, and seeing as we have the latter, it's not worth it. It would be better to just encourage people to be armed for their own protection.

alisonkisk 5y ago

Then you should hope they stop being used as fake mental health counselors.