3 ms·

This comment is very strange when you consider that the only reason there's even traction in switching to mental health professionals is specifically because of

This comment is very strange when you consider that the only reason there's even traction in switching to mental health professionals is specifically because of the injustices inflicted on specific groups and the ensuing protests. I also find it amusing that the tone of your post is that you rightly don't want there to be pointless fights and denounce said pointless fights, but also lament poor language (e.g. "...racist murders"...) while simultaneously using it yourself. Seems pointless given the article in question doesn't use the language you are using nor does it make the claims you're hypothesizing.

Fogest 5y ago
> switching to mental health professionals is specifically because of the injustices inflicted on specific groups and the ensuing protests. That is completely untrue. As I said in my comment there are many countries who have police departments who have enacted special mental health professionals prior to BLM being a thing as they saw a general need for it in their community. Not because one specific minority group called for it. Instead it is because everybody benefited from it.
- endisneigh 5y ago
  We’re talking about the United States so your mention of other countries is completely irrelevant. The police forces of other countries are run completely differently nor do they necessarily suffer from the same issues as the ones in the USA.
  - Fogest 5y ago
    > The police forces of other countries are run completely differently No they are not. That's like saying you're not allowed to compare between other American states because different states run their police departments completely differently. You're just making up arbitrary rules to stipple discussion.
    - endisneigh 5y ago
      if you think other countries police forces are the same as america then we're done here, lmao. ask yourself, how many other countries' average daily police forces have guns? you can't be serious
      - Fogest 5y ago
        I only specifically talked about Canadian police forces which are indeed very similar to American police forces. They may have a bit more training/education but for the most part operationally they are pretty similar. But again, if you don't have anything of substance to say please just stop replying. All you're doing is trying to dismiss what I have stated while providing nothing to the conversation. It's unproductive and useless. Further comments and I will be flagging it.
        endisneigh 5y ago
        look at gun ownership in Canada vs USA. your comparison is nonsensical. furthermore Canadian police follow a single federal code meanwhile USA's police vary wildly per jurisdiction - this has affects both in law enforcement and training. if these facts offend you flag away if you like
        Fogest 5y ago
        Edit: For context, my reply was to what OP originally replied to me with before they decided to make a sneaky edit > look at gun ownership in Canada vs USA. your comparison is nonsensical. flag away if you like We are talking about mental health in relation to policing and that is your argument? About the number of guns owned? That is not a conversation. That is you making zero point and again contributing nothing to the conversation. Just stop if you're not going to have a constructive conversation. You clearly have nothing of merit and are still just trying to dismiss an opinion you disagree with rather than having an intelligent conversation. Maybe Twitter or Reddit would be a better place for this. In regards to your newly edited comment: > Canadian police follow a single federal code meanwhile USA's police vary wildly per jurisdiction - this has affects both in law enforcement and training. if these facts offend you flag away if you like This is only more support for what I said. That you're trying to dismiss my opinion because you say Canada is too different from America, yet you are okay with comparing state by state despite your own words acknowledging how even that doesn't make sense. Your own argument contradicts yourself. Don't try and dismiss my comment by saying countries vary too much to compare, but then in the same paragraph tell me how much America varies in policing by states.
ALittleLight 5y ago
Regarding language use - the article describes this program as one of many "trying to address police violence and systemic racism following George Floyd's murder". That's the basis for my stating that discussion of the program is tied to police violence and racism. Later in the comment, I sum that up as "calling the police racist murderers" which I rephrased to elucidate the problem some people might have with the description, but which is also a faithful rephrase as systemically racist and violent police that commit murder are pretty clearly racist police murders. I can't imagine what other language in my comment you might have a problem with. Please let me know if that wasn't it. I would say that I am not using any poor, inaccurate, or unfair language.
- endisneigh 5y ago
  Your comparison is nonsensical. Calling police racist murderers does not follow from mentioning addressing police violence and systemic racism. Your summation of the situation is more reflective of your interpretation of reality than the actual situation at hand. An accurate analogy per your logic would be to call tech executives sexist after reading an article where it mentions steps are being taken trying to address tech sexism and unequal pay.
  - ALittleLight 5y ago
    If you said "Because of the sexism and discrimination at Blizzard, we are doing X" I would, of course, take it to mean you think Blizzard was sexist and discriminatory. I think that's overwhelmingly obvious - so obvious that I'm not even sure how to argue it. Similarly, it just strikes me as incoherent to say you need a program to address racism in the police, police violence, and murders by the police - but also to say it's an unfair summary to say that you've called the police racist murderers.

Fogest 5y ago

> switching to mental health professionals is specifically because of the injustices inflicted on specific groups and the ensuing protests. That is completely untrue. As I said in my comment there are many countries who have police departments who have enacted special mental health professionals prior to BLM being a thing as they saw a general need for it in their community. Not because one specific minority group called for it. Instead it is because everybody benefited from it.

endisneigh 5y ago
We’re talking about the United States so your mention of other countries is completely irrelevant. The police forces of other countries are run completely differently nor do they necessarily suffer from the same issues as the ones in the USA.
- Fogest 5y ago
  > The police forces of other countries are run completely differently No they are not. That's like saying you're not allowed to compare between other American states because different states run their police departments completely differently. You're just making up arbitrary rules to stipple discussion.
  - endisneigh 5y ago
    if you think other countries police forces are the same as america then we're done here, lmao. ask yourself, how many other countries' average daily police forces have guns? you can't be serious
    - Fogest 5y ago
      I only specifically talked about Canadian police forces which are indeed very similar to American police forces. They may have a bit more training/education but for the most part operationally they are pretty similar. But again, if you don't have anything of substance to say please just stop replying. All you're doing is trying to dismiss what I have stated while providing nothing to the conversation. It's unproductive and useless. Further comments and I will be flagging it.
      - endisneigh 5y ago
        look at gun ownership in Canada vs USA. your comparison is nonsensical. furthermore Canadian police follow a single federal code meanwhile USA's police vary wildly per jurisdiction - this has affects both in law enforcement and training. if these facts offend you flag away if you like
        Fogest 5y ago
        Edit: For context, my reply was to what OP originally replied to me with before they decided to make a sneaky edit > look at gun ownership in Canada vs USA. your comparison is nonsensical. flag away if you like We are talking about mental health in relation to policing and that is your argument? About the number of guns owned? That is not a conversation. That is you making zero point and again contributing nothing to the conversation. Just stop if you're not going to have a constructive conversation. You clearly have nothing of merit and are still just trying to dismiss an opinion you disagree with rather than having an intelligent conversation. Maybe Twitter or Reddit would be a better place for this. In regards to your newly edited comment: > Canadian police follow a single federal code meanwhile USA's police vary wildly per jurisdiction - this has affects both in law enforcement and training. if these facts offend you flag away if you like This is only more support for what I said. That you're trying to dismiss my opinion because you say Canada is too different from America, yet you are okay with comparing state by state despite your own words acknowledging how even that doesn't make sense. Your own argument contradicts yourself. Don't try and dismiss my comment by saying countries vary too much to compare, but then in the same paragraph tell me how much America varies in policing by states.

ALittleLight 5y ago

Regarding language use - the article describes this program as one of many "trying to address police violence and systemic racism following George Floyd's murder". That's the basis for my stating that discussion of the program is tied to police violence and racism. Later in the comment, I sum that up as "calling the police racist murderers" which I rephrased to elucidate the problem some people might have with the description, but which is also a faithful rephrase as systemically racist and violent police that commit murder are pretty clearly racist police murders. I can't imagine what other language in my comment you might have a problem with. Please let me know if that wasn't it. I would say that I am not using any poor, inaccurate, or unfair language.

endisneigh 5y ago
Your comparison is nonsensical. Calling police racist murderers does not follow from mentioning addressing police violence and systemic racism. Your summation of the situation is more reflective of your interpretation of reality than the actual situation at hand. An accurate analogy per your logic would be to call tech executives sexist after reading an article where it mentions steps are being taken trying to address tech sexism and unequal pay.
- ALittleLight 5y ago
  If you said "Because of the sexism and discrimination at Blizzard, we are doing X" I would, of course, take it to mean you think Blizzard was sexist and discriminatory. I think that's overwhelmingly obvious - so obvious that I'm not even sure how to argue it. Similarly, it just strikes me as incoherent to say you need a program to address racism in the police, police violence, and murders by the police - but also to say it's an unfair summary to say that you've called the police racist murderers.