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> Hate speech laws, IMO, cause more harm than good. What's your evidence? They seem to work fine here in Germany.

by tpush 5y ago

selectodude 5y ago
hate speech is relative. allowing speech to be banned means that the group in power can ban whatever they deem to be hateful.
- JKCalhoun 5y ago
  Sure, at their own peril. Ban speech we, collectively as a society deem hateful, no problem. Ban speech that is critical of those in power .... well, good luck with that. History is not on your side.
daenz 5y ago
An opinion does not require evidence. And even if it did, it should be clear that no such study on such a vague and politically sensitive topic, such as the efficacy of hate speech laws, could ever be conclusive. If you have an opposing opinion, that's fine, but maybe voice why you hold it instead of demanding evidence for others opinions. Personally I think it's silly to jail an 89-year old grandmother for denying the Holocaust[0], but things like that can happen with hate speech laws like Germany has. 0. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2018/05/08/nazi-grandma-ursula-haverbeck-who-denies-holocaust-taken-jail/589613002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2018/05/08/nazi-gr...
- em-bee 5y ago
  look at how active she was and judge for yourself. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ursula_Haverbeck https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ursula_Haverbeck
  - daenz 5y ago
    Uncontroversial speech does not need protection. Sentencing someone to prison for 1/10th of their remaining life span for publishing hurtful words is barbaric.
    - _ph_ 5y ago
      No, it is not. If you read about her, she isn't a first offender. Quite the contrary. And you don't go directly into prison for crimes like this, you start with a penalty payment. To get sentenced to prison requires quite a bit of activity. Yes, it might sound harsh to be sentenced to prison with 90, but it is at most ages. Younger people who have to go to prison might lose their job, their relationships, contact to their family. Still, no judge will sentence a person that old to prison unless the law, and of course the crimes performed, don't leave an alternative. She was denying the holocaust for decades.

> Hate speech laws, IMO, cause more harm than good. What's your evidence? They seem to work fine here in Germany.

by tpush 5y ago

> Hate speech laws, IMO, cause more harm than good. What's your evidence? They seem to work fine here in Germany.

hate speech is relative. allowing speech to be banned means that the group in power can ban whatever they deem to be hateful.

JKCalhoun 5y ago
Sure, at their own peril. Ban speech we, collectively as a society deem hateful, no problem. Ban speech that is critical of those in power .... well, good luck with that. History is not on your side.

daenz 5y ago

An opinion does not require evidence. And even if it did, it should be clear that no such study on such a vague and politically sensitive topic, such as the efficacy of hate speech laws, could ever be conclusive. If you have an opposing opinion, that's fine, but maybe voice why you hold it instead of demanding evidence for others opinions. Personally I think it's silly to jail an 89-year old grandmother for denying the Holocaust[0], but things like that can happen with hate speech laws like Germany has. 0. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2018/05/08/nazi-grandma-ursula-haverbeck-who-denies-holocaust-taken-jail/589613002/ https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2018/05/08/nazi-gr...

em-bee 5y ago
look at how active she was and judge for yourself. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ursula_Haverbeck https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ursula_Haverbeck
- daenz 5y ago
  Uncontroversial speech does not need protection. Sentencing someone to prison for 1/10th of their remaining life span for publishing hurtful words is barbaric.
  - _ph_ 5y ago
    No, it is not. If you read about her, she isn't a first offender. Quite the contrary. And you don't go directly into prison for crimes like this, you start with a penalty payment. To get sentenced to prison requires quite a bit of activity. Yes, it might sound harsh to be sentenced to prison with 90, but it is at most ages. Younger people who have to go to prison might lose their job, their relationships, contact to their family. Still, no judge will sentence a person that old to prison unless the law, and of course the crimes performed, don't leave an alternative. She was denying the holocaust for decades.