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VR/AR is such a new paradigm for interacting with computers I think that its inevitable companies will make many failures before finding the apps and hardware t

by giobox 5y ago

VR/AR is such a new paradigm for interacting with computers I think that its inevitable companies will make many failures before finding the apps and hardware that clicks with customers. In 2017, we had only had mainstream non-beta VR headset hardware in the marketplace since 2016 (original consumer Rift, HTC Vive), lets not forget the 20 years of PDA hardware/software attempts we lived through before the mainstream smartphone designs we all use appeared in 2007. I expect a very similar arc will be followed for VR/AR, especially as the interaction model is so different from screen based. I'm happy to see some development out "in the open", and wouldn't be so quick to criticize small project flops; VR/AR needs to begin somewhere. Zuck isn't trying to pretend VR/AR is ready for primetime either yet, he's made it clear he wants to be in a very strong position when/if the market does heavily move to VR/AR hardware, which he obviously believes strongly it will over time.

erikpukinskis 5y ago
Notably, I think eye contact is a killer app for VR and none of the headsets can do it yet. Facebook is smart to be in there doing experiments and failing though. That's table stakes for having a shot at winning the competition.
Animats 5y ago
VR/AR is such a new paradigm for interacting with computers. Not really. I tried Jaron Lainer's original VR rig back in the 1980s. The Autodesk system from the 1980s. The W Industries system ... the HTC Vibe. The Microsoft HoloLens. There's been progress, but usability really hasn't improved all that much. You can shoot at people. That works fine. You can sort of use swords. Everything else, not so much. That's why Beat Saber is still the most successful VR game. Some Autodesk people once thought that VR would make it easier to use CAD, because selection in 3D with a mouse is such a pain. Didn't work out, and 3D selection with a mouse got much better. If anybody gets this right, it might be NVidia Omniverse. That's an attempt to do for 3D what shared text editors do for text documents.
- baby 5y ago
  Oh my, reading your comment I couldn’t stop myself from laughing. I too tried the old VR headsets, played doom on one and got a massive headache. I thought VR was bad and stupid after that. Then I tried the HTC Vive and holy molly I almost cried after trying it. Now I own an Oculus Quest II and… it is the future. I’m sorry but this is it.
- h2odragon 5y ago
  The Autodesk system ran on what, a pair of RS/6000? I got to chat with some of their guys showing that off at a trade show in off moments over a few days; they were great at running the demo but were umm... unenthused about the prospects of anyone keeping the system running for any time without high grade help.
- andybak 5y ago
  3d selection in VR is better. Just give it a hundredth of the investment we've given desktop UI
- wcarss 5y ago
  I think the biggest selection problem is the Minority Report UI problem: hanging hands are not precise tools, nor are they comfortable to hold up for > ~a minute. In particular, it is very hard to do even one pixel-perfect point+grab+release in 3D space, let alone do it over and over -- in large part because you can't easily lock a dimension or the position and rest your hand. Touch-screens are hard to get precise-clicks on for a similar reason: with a mouse I can line it up and hit fire, with touch I'm firing until I let go. If someone gets the right metaphor going there, I think it could work great, but the naive solution of 1:N direct scaling the position of your hand to a co-ordinate in space isn't it. I imagine it'll be something like direct correlation to get 'in the neighbourhood' and then an easy modal toggle to a 'precision' mode, where you move something in small increments along just 1 or 2 dimensions, using a comfortable binary gesture. Or maybe AI will get really good at guessing what alignment the user wants.
  - checker 5y ago
    As far as control interface goes, it seems almost inevitable that we'll eventually have a breakthrough/refinement for some sort of mental control without physical movement (similar to how some amputees control their advanced prosthetics). It would be a game changer for VR.

by giobox 5y ago

erikpukinskis 5y ago

Notably, I think eye contact is a killer app for VR and none of the headsets can do it yet. Facebook is smart to be in there doing experiments and failing though. That's table stakes for having a shot at winning the competition.

Animats 5y ago

VR/AR is such a new paradigm for interacting with computers. Not really. I tried Jaron Lainer's original VR rig back in the 1980s. The Autodesk system from the 1980s. The W Industries system ... the HTC Vibe. The Microsoft HoloLens. There's been progress, but usability really hasn't improved all that much. You can shoot at people. That works fine. You can sort of use swords. Everything else, not so much. That's why Beat Saber is still the most successful VR game. Some Autodesk people once thought that VR would make it easier to use CAD, because selection in 3D with a mouse is such a pain. Didn't work out, and 3D selection with a mouse got much better. If anybody gets this right, it might be NVidia Omniverse. That's an attempt to do for 3D what shared text editors do for text documents.

baby 5y ago
Oh my, reading your comment I couldn’t stop myself from laughing. I too tried the old VR headsets, played doom on one and got a massive headache. I thought VR was bad and stupid after that. Then I tried the HTC Vive and holy molly I almost cried after trying it. Now I own an Oculus Quest II and… it is the future. I’m sorry but this is it.
h2odragon 5y ago
The Autodesk system ran on what, a pair of RS/6000? I got to chat with some of their guys showing that off at a trade show in off moments over a few days; they were great at running the demo but were umm... unenthused about the prospects of anyone keeping the system running for any time without high grade help.
andybak 5y ago
3d selection in VR is better. Just give it a hundredth of the investment we've given desktop UI
wcarss 5y ago
I think the biggest selection problem is the Minority Report UI problem: hanging hands are not precise tools, nor are they comfortable to hold up for > ~a minute. In particular, it is very hard to do even one pixel-perfect point+grab+release in 3D space, let alone do it over and over -- in large part because you can't easily lock a dimension or the position and rest your hand. Touch-screens are hard to get precise-clicks on for a similar reason: with a mouse I can line it up and hit fire, with touch I'm firing until I let go. If someone gets the right metaphor going there, I think it could work great, but the naive solution of 1:N direct scaling the position of your hand to a co-ordinate in space isn't it. I imagine it'll be something like direct correlation to get 'in the neighbourhood' and then an easy modal toggle to a 'precision' mode, where you move something in small increments along just 1 or 2 dimensions, using a comfortable binary gesture. Or maybe AI will get really good at guessing what alignment the user wants.
- checker 5y ago
  As far as control interface goes, it seems almost inevitable that we'll eventually have a breakthrough/refinement for some sort of mental control without physical movement (similar to how some amputees control their advanced prosthetics). It would be a game changer for VR.