3 ms·

I'll save a lot of you a click and a long-ass read here: This entire essay is 1 part "The Good Old Days"... > In this same period, young people grew increasin

I'll save a lot of you a click and a long-ass read here: This entire essay is 1 part "The Good Old Days"... > In this same period, young people grew increasingly tolerant of social misdemeanours such as habitually failing to keep promises, using profane language, and keeping extra change mistakenly given by a store clerk – minor incivilities by today’s standards, but harbingers of a changing social landscape where the transgression of established norms was starting to become more common and accepted. ...1 part plugging his own book... > Paul Howe is professor of political science at the University of New Brunswick in Fredericton, Canada. He is the author of Teen Spirit: How Adolescence Transformed the Adult World (2020). ...1 part social/political commentary (Not going to quote the massive section about Trump), and 1 part whining about "kids these days don't want to be cogs in the machine" (Multiple sections about putting "I" before "We".)

mimixco 5y ago
You kinda missed the TL;DR, no? He says because of that teenage culture, we now having teenage level thinking and behavior in what should have otherwise been mature adults, and with dire consequences.
- bussierem 5y ago
  First off, I did read it, so a TLDR isn't needed. Second, sure that's his claim, but I'm challenging the premise. If your premise is faulty, then what follows is questionable and not proven. Pining for the "good old days" and saying how great they were in your memory does not prove anything about today.
  - mimixco 5y ago
    The TL;DR is for people who didn't read it. I thought the premise was obvious. He didn't go into great detail explaining how selfish, rude, and immature thinking cripples every part of society today from the drive-thru to the emergency room. I thought everyone could see that. Perhaps because I'm old, the change is more obvious, but I can tell you there's been a change.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
  - xg15 5y ago
    The ancient romans were already lamenting "kids these days will be our downfall" and look how the roman empire stands today... oh, wait. More seriously, I agree, the premise is a tired trope, but I still think you need better counter-arguments to disprove it. Saying "this argument is cliche, therefore I can assume it is wrong" is not really sound reasoning.
    - mimixco 5y ago
      In fact, that's not what it says. It says the kids of the 60's and 70's who are already adults are already causing problems today because of attitudes and habits they picked up back then. This is not an old argument and a careful reading of the text will show that he starts with the mass movement of children to high school. When Americans lived on farms, we didn't have that. (We had one room schools and my grandmother taught in one as her first job.) The author's premise is that high school changed everything and created a "high school mentality" that's still very much with us -- in people who are now 50 and certainly in people younger than that. He gives numerous examples of how acceptance of this fact is already the norm in popular culture. So he's not bemoaning the kids of today, but the adults of today, and explaining one way we might have got there.
dang 5y ago
"Please don't post shallow dismissals, especially of other people's work. A good critical comment teaches us something." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
908B64B197 5y ago
It's interesting how you see a lot of research from foreign professors and universities about American trends. And a lot of coverage of American politic in foreign news. The opposite doesn't hold true. I guess in the social sciences, bashing on the previous administration is seen as a way for career advancement? Even abroad?

mimixco 5y ago

You kinda missed the TL;DR, no? He says because of that teenage culture, we now having teenage level thinking and behavior in what should have otherwise been mature adults, and with dire consequences.

bussierem 5y ago
First off, I did read it, so a TLDR isn't needed. Second, sure that's his claim, but I'm challenging the premise. If your premise is faulty, then what follows is questionable and not proven. Pining for the "good old days" and saying how great they were in your memory does not prove anything about today.
- mimixco 5y ago
  The TL;DR is for people who didn't read it. I thought the premise was obvious. He didn't go into great detail explaining how selfish, rude, and immature thinking cripples every part of society today from the drive-thru to the emergency room. I thought everyone could see that. Perhaps because I'm old, the change is more obvious, but I can tell you there's been a change.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- xg15 5y ago
  The ancient romans were already lamenting "kids these days will be our downfall" and look how the roman empire stands today... oh, wait. More seriously, I agree, the premise is a tired trope, but I still think you need better counter-arguments to disprove it. Saying "this argument is cliche, therefore I can assume it is wrong" is not really sound reasoning.
  - mimixco 5y ago
    In fact, that's not what it says. It says the kids of the 60's and 70's who are already adults are already causing problems today because of attitudes and habits they picked up back then. This is not an old argument and a careful reading of the text will show that he starts with the mass movement of children to high school. When Americans lived on farms, we didn't have that. (We had one room schools and my grandmother taught in one as her first job.) The author's premise is that high school changed everything and created a "high school mentality" that's still very much with us -- in people who are now 50 and certainly in people younger than that. He gives numerous examples of how acceptance of this fact is already the norm in popular culture. So he's not bemoaning the kids of today, but the adults of today, and explaining one way we might have got there.

dang 5y ago

"Please don't post shallow dismissals, especially of other people's work. A good critical comment teaches us something." https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

908B64B197 5y ago

It's interesting how you see a lot of research from foreign professors and universities about American trends. And a lot of coverage of American politic in foreign news. The opposite doesn't hold true. I guess in the social sciences, bashing on the previous administration is seen as a way for career advancement? Even abroad?