5 ms·

Opinion: What I Saw in Yosemite Was Devastating

58 points by uptown 5y ago

brettermeier 5y ago
https://archive.is/uYPg2 https://archive.is/uYPg2
snypher 5y ago
You think that's devastating? Go check out what happens at 6001 Bollinger Canyon Rd, San Ramon, CA.
- recursive 5y ago
  It's entirely possible they could both be devastating. It's not zero-sum. However, I have to say, I didn't actually go there. I can't figure out what you're talking about. Seems to be the site of "Chevron Federal Credit Union". I can't see that anything in particular really happened.
  - lotsofpulp 5y ago
    It’s also funny that the author of the OpEd flew (presumably) her son from NYC to see the place, needing the services of Chevron or companies like it. Moving mass requires energy. Using energy results in an increase in entropy (heat). We went from 2 billion to 8 billion people in 100 years, each life moving exponentially more mass than the generation before it. Absent the discovery of a miraculously efficient energy source, there were only ever 2 options. Either force reduction in consumption per capita and/or capitas, or live in the future we are living in now. The former was never going to be politically popular, and I suspect the author of the OpEd also would not like to be told she cannot take her child to see Yosemite from NYC via current methods of transport.
- throw_bollinger 5y ago
  (throwaway, not connecting my workplace to my main acct.) I work across the street from 6001 Bollinger and went to check it out on a whim. Looks pretty mundane. What exactly am I supposed to be looking for? Is it the fact that it's a Chevron corporate campus?
vaylian 5y ago
And yet, most of humanity still seems to be only vaguely aware of how much things are breaking all around us. And politicians are unfortunately not an exception.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
xadhominemx 5y ago
I don’t want understate the impact of climate change, but if the author is comparing the dryness of 2021 specifically to 1993… 1993 was the 5th wettest year in California since the 1930s, and 2021 is a drought year.
- Cthulhu_ 5y ago
  The changes he's observing are not just from one year of drought. He specifically highlights a fire in 2018 leaving hills blackened and bare. In summer, the water comes not from rainfall but glaciers that are supposed to build up during winter. It's not just from this year.
  - xadhominemx 5y ago
    That’s an even better example of my point. The size and frequency of wildfires overall is increasing, but the probability of a fire striking one particular area in a given 10 year period (ie, burn scar still obvious) is still very low.
    - adi4213 5y ago
      One point the author also made was the impact of insects (perhaps bark beetles?) are having on the trees and attributed to the warmer temperatures allowing them to thrive and wreak havoc
friseurtermin 5y ago
> Now, almost 30 years later, in what might be the most profound shift of all, the power dynamic between humans and Yosemite has changed. To see nature so vulnerable not only feels depressing, but wrong, disorienting and scary. Beautiful piece, but that's hardly the whole story. Nature doesn't care about climate change and it couldn't care less about us. Sure, it might kill all the birds, trees, landscapes, but our planet will adapt. We, humans, won't be able to. What we're destroying is our own future, both the beauty in the world and the environment we live in.
- donatj 5y ago
  > our planet will adapt. We, humans, won't be able to. We are by far Nature’s most adaptable creation, we live everywhere from the harshest deserts to the frozen tundra. I find the idea that we won’t adapt remarkably laughable.
  - lotsofpulp 5y ago
    Humans have been around 6M years. The Earth has been around 4.5B years. I find the idea “we” will adapt because of humans’ success in adapting over a minute fraction of the Earth’s existence remarkably laughable. People are also concerned about quality of life, not just survival.
    - donatj 5y ago
      We adapted to its harshest climates over a remarkably small timeframe, something that took other species eons. I think you’ve made my point.
      - lotsofpulp 5y ago
        The dataset is too small to “make” any point. 6M years out of 4.5B years( or even more if you expand out into the universe) is a fluke. The climate can change faster than we can, and we can destroy each other or set each other pretty far back technologically. Either way, there are myriad reasons that the relatively recent past need not be indicative of the future.
roenxi 5y ago
> “Emerson, Thoreau, Fuller — their accounts of nature are that it’s perfect,” Dr. Strong said. “You would go and learn from this limitless teacher. Nature was pure truth. It offered access to the infinite, a stand-in for God.” I enjoy being the literal one here - this is not aligned to what we observe. Nature can inspire, but most of the legwork is done by humans in labs and houses nestled in the largest of cities. Most of the pinnacles of human achievement (the law, heavier than air flight, undersea transport, the highway and rail networks, spaceflight, mastering radiowaves and digital communication) we have surpassed what nature could teach us by superior control of energy, theory and materials. It isn't nature that propelled us into the modern era. It was cities. Pretty much everyone with the means chooses to stay in the heart of a city with rare visits to nature because cities are just more supportive of humans, more interesting and more prosperous. There are people who get a lot out of going to visit nature. They are relatively rare.
throwntoday 5y ago
I appreciate the pristine and untouched beauty of Yosemite as much as anyone, and I backpack in its wilderness at least once a year. But the government could be doing a lot more to clear the forests and prevent the rapid spread of wildfires. Auctioning off the old growth they need to chop down, or clearing the forest floor of fuel where possible could pay for itself, and protect what is left.
kilroy123 5y ago
I can certainly relate. I grew up a few hours away from Yosemite. I went there many times growing up as a kid in the 90s. I moved away from California back in 2010. On a trip back home a couple of years ago, I visited Yosemite for the first time in many years. I felt the same and couldn't believe what it was like. The valley filled to the brim with hours-long traffic jams—everything filled with smoke. It was all very different from how I remembered it.
marcasey 5y ago
This shows that we should take good care of our surroundings. But I still do believe that the climate will still take a hit in the following years. We should think of a long term remedy for this one.
lurquer 5y ago
He should see what they’ve done to Manhattan Island.
soheil 5y ago
It's odd some don't think we have been adapting every step of the way and will continue to do so far more competently than almost any other organism thanks to our reasoning power and its fruit, a highly capable advanced civilization. If the next pandemic hits and 7 billion people are wiped out that's adapting too because 1 billion survived. Alarmists need stop conflating improving quality of life vs survivability of our specie which is what the discussion about adaptability is always anchored in.

58 points by uptown 5y ago

brettermeier 5y ago

https://archive.is/uYPg2 https://archive.is/uYPg2

snypher 5y ago

You think that's devastating? Go check out what happens at 6001 Bollinger Canyon Rd, San Ramon, CA.

recursive 5y ago
It's entirely possible they could both be devastating. It's not zero-sum. However, I have to say, I didn't actually go there. I can't figure out what you're talking about. Seems to be the site of "Chevron Federal Credit Union". I can't see that anything in particular really happened.
- lotsofpulp 5y ago
  It’s also funny that the author of the OpEd flew (presumably) her son from NYC to see the place, needing the services of Chevron or companies like it. Moving mass requires energy. Using energy results in an increase in entropy (heat). We went from 2 billion to 8 billion people in 100 years, each life moving exponentially more mass than the generation before it. Absent the discovery of a miraculously efficient energy source, there were only ever 2 options. Either force reduction in consumption per capita and/or capitas, or live in the future we are living in now. The former was never going to be politically popular, and I suspect the author of the OpEd also would not like to be told she cannot take her child to see Yosemite from NYC via current methods of transport.
throw_bollinger 5y ago
(throwaway, not connecting my workplace to my main acct.) I work across the street from 6001 Bollinger and went to check it out on a whim. Looks pretty mundane. What exactly am I supposed to be looking for? Is it the fact that it's a Chevron corporate campus?

vaylian 5y ago

And yet, most of humanity still seems to be only vaguely aware of how much things are breaking all around us. And politicians are unfortunately not an exception.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

xadhominemx 5y ago

I don’t want understate the impact of climate change, but if the author is comparing the dryness of 2021 specifically to 1993… 1993 was the 5th wettest year in California since the 1930s, and 2021 is a drought year.

Cthulhu_ 5y ago
The changes he's observing are not just from one year of drought. He specifically highlights a fire in 2018 leaving hills blackened and bare. In summer, the water comes not from rainfall but glaciers that are supposed to build up during winter. It's not just from this year.
- xadhominemx 5y ago
  That’s an even better example of my point. The size and frequency of wildfires overall is increasing, but the probability of a fire striking one particular area in a given 10 year period (ie, burn scar still obvious) is still very low.
  - adi4213 5y ago
    One point the author also made was the impact of insects (perhaps bark beetles?) are having on the trees and attributed to the warmer temperatures allowing them to thrive and wreak havoc

friseurtermin 5y ago

> Now, almost 30 years later, in what might be the most profound shift of all, the power dynamic between humans and Yosemite has changed. To see nature so vulnerable not only feels depressing, but wrong, disorienting and scary. Beautiful piece, but that's hardly the whole story. Nature doesn't care about climate change and it couldn't care less about us. Sure, it might kill all the birds, trees, landscapes, but our planet will adapt. We, humans, won't be able to. What we're destroying is our own future, both the beauty in the world and the environment we live in.

donatj 5y ago
> our planet will adapt. We, humans, won't be able to. We are by far Nature’s most adaptable creation, we live everywhere from the harshest deserts to the frozen tundra. I find the idea that we won’t adapt remarkably laughable.
- lotsofpulp 5y ago
  Humans have been around 6M years. The Earth has been around 4.5B years. I find the idea “we” will adapt because of humans’ success in adapting over a minute fraction of the Earth’s existence remarkably laughable. People are also concerned about quality of life, not just survival.
  - donatj 5y ago
    We adapted to its harshest climates over a remarkably small timeframe, something that took other species eons. I think you’ve made my point.
    - lotsofpulp 5y ago
      The dataset is too small to “make” any point. 6M years out of 4.5B years( or even more if you expand out into the universe) is a fluke. The climate can change faster than we can, and we can destroy each other or set each other pretty far back technologically. Either way, there are myriad reasons that the relatively recent past need not be indicative of the future.

roenxi 5y ago

> “Emerson, Thoreau, Fuller — their accounts of nature are that it’s perfect,” Dr. Strong said. “You would go and learn from this limitless teacher. Nature was pure truth. It offered access to the infinite, a stand-in for God.” I enjoy being the literal one here - this is not aligned to what we observe. Nature can inspire, but most of the legwork is done by humans in labs and houses nestled in the largest of cities. Most of the pinnacles of human achievement (the law, heavier than air flight, undersea transport, the highway and rail networks, spaceflight, mastering radiowaves and digital communication) we have surpassed what nature could teach us by superior control of energy, theory and materials. It isn't nature that propelled us into the modern era. It was cities. Pretty much everyone with the means chooses to stay in the heart of a city with rare visits to nature because cities are just more supportive of humans, more interesting and more prosperous. There are people who get a lot out of going to visit nature. They are relatively rare.

throwntoday 5y ago

I appreciate the pristine and untouched beauty of Yosemite as much as anyone, and I backpack in its wilderness at least once a year. But the government could be doing a lot more to clear the forests and prevent the rapid spread of wildfires. Auctioning off the old growth they need to chop down, or clearing the forest floor of fuel where possible could pay for itself, and protect what is left.

kilroy123 5y ago

I can certainly relate. I grew up a few hours away from Yosemite. I went there many times growing up as a kid in the 90s. I moved away from California back in 2010. On a trip back home a couple of years ago, I visited Yosemite for the first time in many years. I felt the same and couldn't believe what it was like. The valley filled to the brim with hours-long traffic jams—everything filled with smoke. It was all very different from how I remembered it.

marcasey 5y ago

This shows that we should take good care of our surroundings. But I still do believe that the climate will still take a hit in the following years. We should think of a long term remedy for this one.

lurquer 5y ago

He should see what they’ve done to Manhattan Island.

soheil 5y ago

It's odd some don't think we have been adapting every step of the way and will continue to do so far more competently than almost any other organism thanks to our reasoning power and its fruit, a highly capable advanced civilization. If the next pandemic hits and 7 billion people are wiped out that's adapting too because 1 billion survived. Alarmists need stop conflating improving quality of life vs survivability of our specie which is what the discussion about adaptability is always anchored in.