5 ms·

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_Russia https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_i... I don't know if you're bei

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_in_Russia https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_journalists_killed_i... I don't know if you're being facetious or naive, but Putin is a ruthless dictator whose regime is responsible for a galling number of blatant political assassinations. Not to mention Ukraine and nuke testing and state sanctioned hacking. Or the total corruption of democratic reform in Russia. Litvinenko was one of the most high profile, with radioactive tea playing a novel role as a murder weapon. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poisoning_of_Alexander_Litvinenko https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poisoning_of_Alexander_Litvi... Oh, and China is clearly just misunderstood, they're actually really good for the world! /s https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/meghara/china-camps-prisons-xinjiang-muslims-size https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/meghara/china-camps-pri... https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/4250097 https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/4250097 It's curious how many people reliably show up to defend either Russia or China on this forum. Civilization in modern times is a game of good faith. Both of these countries have unendingly demonstrated their total lack of good faith, without any regard or respect for their erstwhile partners in the west, their geographical neighbors, or even their own citizens. It baffles me that so many in silicon valley are so willing to abandon any pretense at ethics or moral values, of even the most basic humanistic variety, to simply earn a few bucks on the backs of sino slave labor. But carry on, you were telling us all that the concentration camps and political assassinations and imperial aggressions and all that is just propaganda...

GoblinSlayer 5y ago
So Russia bad and must be killed with fire?
- robbedpeter 5y ago
  Well that escalated quickly. I'd like to see a great enlightenment and progress toward a post scarcity, humanist, democratic, liberal, freedom loving future in which people can live their best lives, as free as possible of pointless suffering at the hands of assholes. I mean, call me radical, but with reality now as one end of a spectrum, and the above utopic fantasy as the other, it should be obvious what humanity should be moving toward. The history of all of the most free and liberal societies hold great suffering and sacrifice in their past. The bloodshed and revolution that purchased their freedoms might not be an option now that the tyrants have nukes, so that leaves intellectual revolution as the last feasible option for human progress. It's the greed and cynicism of the wealthy and powerful that perpetuate the status quo. Ideologues and selfish exploiters create space for massive corruption. These regimes may be effectively unstoppable, since the west is so eager to capitulate at the first sign of profit. It may be the best and only thing we can do to simply talk about the crimes and abuses of those in power, and never let up.
  - GoblinSlayer 5y ago
    The road to post scarcity isn't without risks, once we have enough technology for total control, but not enough for post scarcity, that will be a twist.
pphysch 5y ago
It is crystal clear that you are proceeding from the preconceived notion that Russia and China are essentially "evil", rather than arriving at that conclusion through critical scrutiny of available evidence and historical trends. To you, any allegation from a Washington-aligned media source is a) unquestioningly true and b) evidence of the respective government's bad behavior. You do this automatically, without considering the alternatives. Do these media sources have an incentive to misrepresent their foreign subjects? For example, to maintain good relations with Western governments, or to score lucrative contracts. If so, why would they not act on that incentive? Do Western intelligence services have an incentive to manufacture evidence against their opponents? Why would they not act on this incentive? Indeed, there are countless well-established historical examples of this behavior, from the USS Maine to the OPCW cover-up. Yet to modern Western chauvinists, that behavior is eternally in the past and could never explain present controversies.
- robbedpeter 5y ago
  Way to go with the attempt at obfuscation, but China is actively engaged in imperial encroachment on Taiwan, abused Hong Kong and is suppressing any and all dissent, and are imprisoning people based on ethnicity and religion in concentration camps. They also threatened Japan with nuclear first strike just in the last 96 hours. The Africa situation, the spread of misinformation and obstruction with regards to covid, and the endless parade of human rights abuses in their manufacturing infrastructure are also front and center in the world's eyes. By all means, though, continue with your narrative. Obviously China is just a force for good in the world, and is just misunderstood because of all that nasty CIA propaganda.
  - pphysch 5y ago
    This entire comment is dripping with "fake news", like a Trumper hopped up on Pizzagate and Qanon. I mean this sincerely: you seriously need to reexamine where you get your information, and exercise a bit of critical scrutiny instead of mindlessly regurgitating headlines from Reddit. This is totally, dangerously insane.
    - 5y ago
justicezyx 5y ago
> https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/4250097 https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/4250097 Please, at least get the source for MSM in US. Taiwan media famously claimed that most Chinese mainlanders cannot afford pickled vegs [1]. Taiwan media outlets are the laughing stock of democratic reporting, they are money- and attention-grabbing, and without much respect for anything. [1] https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3022190/taiwanese-financial-expert-mocked-saying-many-mainland-chinese https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3022190/taiw...

GoblinSlayer 5y ago

So Russia bad and must be killed with fire?

robbedpeter 5y ago
Well that escalated quickly. I'd like to see a great enlightenment and progress toward a post scarcity, humanist, democratic, liberal, freedom loving future in which people can live their best lives, as free as possible of pointless suffering at the hands of assholes. I mean, call me radical, but with reality now as one end of a spectrum, and the above utopic fantasy as the other, it should be obvious what humanity should be moving toward. The history of all of the most free and liberal societies hold great suffering and sacrifice in their past. The bloodshed and revolution that purchased their freedoms might not be an option now that the tyrants have nukes, so that leaves intellectual revolution as the last feasible option for human progress. It's the greed and cynicism of the wealthy and powerful that perpetuate the status quo. Ideologues and selfish exploiters create space for massive corruption. These regimes may be effectively unstoppable, since the west is so eager to capitulate at the first sign of profit. It may be the best and only thing we can do to simply talk about the crimes and abuses of those in power, and never let up.
- GoblinSlayer 5y ago
  The road to post scarcity isn't without risks, once we have enough technology for total control, but not enough for post scarcity, that will be a twist.

pphysch 5y ago

It is crystal clear that you are proceeding from the preconceived notion that Russia and China are essentially "evil", rather than arriving at that conclusion through critical scrutiny of available evidence and historical trends. To you, any allegation from a Washington-aligned media source is a) unquestioningly true and b) evidence of the respective government's bad behavior. You do this automatically, without considering the alternatives. Do these media sources have an incentive to misrepresent their foreign subjects? For example, to maintain good relations with Western governments, or to score lucrative contracts. If so, why would they not act on that incentive? Do Western intelligence services have an incentive to manufacture evidence against their opponents? Why would they not act on this incentive? Indeed, there are countless well-established historical examples of this behavior, from the USS Maine to the OPCW cover-up. Yet to modern Western chauvinists, that behavior is eternally in the past and could never explain present controversies.

robbedpeter 5y ago
Way to go with the attempt at obfuscation, but China is actively engaged in imperial encroachment on Taiwan, abused Hong Kong and is suppressing any and all dissent, and are imprisoning people based on ethnicity and religion in concentration camps. They also threatened Japan with nuclear first strike just in the last 96 hours. The Africa situation, the spread of misinformation and obstruction with regards to covid, and the endless parade of human rights abuses in their manufacturing infrastructure are also front and center in the world's eyes. By all means, though, continue with your narrative. Obviously China is just a force for good in the world, and is just misunderstood because of all that nasty CIA propaganda.
- pphysch 5y ago
  This entire comment is dripping with "fake news", like a Trumper hopped up on Pizzagate and Qanon. I mean this sincerely: you seriously need to reexamine where you get your information, and exercise a bit of critical scrutiny instead of mindlessly regurgitating headlines from Reddit. This is totally, dangerously insane.
  - 5y ago

justicezyx 5y ago

> https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/4250097 https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/4250097 Please, at least get the source for MSM in US. Taiwan media famously claimed that most Chinese mainlanders cannot afford pickled vegs [1]. Taiwan media outlets are the laughing stock of democratic reporting, they are money- and attention-grabbing, and without much respect for anything. [1] https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3022190/taiwanese-financial-expert-mocked-saying-many-mainland-chinese https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3022190/taiw...