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> One flaw with the analogy [...] Many people who attempt it have literally no idea they will when they wake up that morning. Can you elaborate? That sounds pr

by Jare 5y ago

> One flaw with the analogy [...] Many people who attempt it have literally no idea they will when they wake up that morning. Can you elaborate? That sounds pretty much like the people in the analogy to me. They jump because the alternative they face right now is more terrifying for some reason. It makes sense that not all methods of suicide fulfill that criteria (being less terrifying than the alternative), even if they are all methods to end your life.

dalmo3 5y ago
I reacted the same way when I read that part too, but the rest of the comment illustrates it well with the failed attempts data. To go back to the analogy, it's as if they try to jump from the window, but there's a safety net that blocks them. They're stuck inside and the fire is mysteriously gone.
- kelnos 5y ago
  I don't think the fire is mysteriously gone in this imagining of the analogy. More like it is still there, but is survivable: still very hot, still very scary, but not clearly moving to inevitably consume you. I think this is just another place where the analogy breaks down. But that's ok, no analogy is perfect, but I think this one does have its uses.
  - quantum_magpie 5y ago
    I still think the original analogy works here - if you make sure that in the moment of panic the windows don't open to prevent voluntary and quick death, the person now has to suffer the agonizing pain of the flames for the rest of their life. It holds even more true if we consider that a large part of suicides are not because someone wants to die - no - it's because someone does not want to live like in present situation anymore. Just like with the fire, the goal is not to die on a sidewalk - it's not dying in the fire. You attempt suicide as last resort - if you die, it's okay, it's final. If you don't, it perhaps changes something for the better.

by Jare 5y ago

dalmo3 5y ago

I reacted the same way when I read that part too, but the rest of the comment illustrates it well with the failed attempts data. To go back to the analogy, it's as if they try to jump from the window, but there's a safety net that blocks them. They're stuck inside and the fire is mysteriously gone.

kelnos 5y ago
I don't think the fire is mysteriously gone in this imagining of the analogy. More like it is still there, but is survivable: still very hot, still very scary, but not clearly moving to inevitably consume you. I think this is just another place where the analogy breaks down. But that's ok, no analogy is perfect, but I think this one does have its uses.
- quantum_magpie 5y ago
  I still think the original analogy works here - if you make sure that in the moment of panic the windows don't open to prevent voluntary and quick death, the person now has to suffer the agonizing pain of the flames for the rest of their life. It holds even more true if we consider that a large part of suicides are not because someone wants to die - no - it's because someone does not want to live like in present situation anymore. Just like with the fire, the goal is not to die on a sidewalk - it's not dying in the fire. You attempt suicide as last resort - if you die, it's okay, it's final. If you don't, it perhaps changes something for the better.