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My argument isn’t that it’s not a corner case, it most certainly is. I wouldn’t need it more than a few times a year max. My point is that the “extra hassle” of

by atty 5y ago

My argument isn’t that it’s not a corner case, it most certainly is. I wouldn’t need it more than a few times a year max. My point is that the “extra hassle” of a tap to pay system is so amazingly minuscule it’s more than worth it to include the extra flexibility. Tap to pay credit cards and phone NFC payment options are so easy to use now that losing any flexibility at all to not have to use them is not a good trade off, at least in my opinion.

ericd 5y ago
Eh there’s usually still some interface to deal with in those systems, here you don’t have to do anything, it probably cuts off more than half of the interaction time. When it’s been pouring rain, I’ve been especially thankful I didn’t have to fumble for a card in my wallet.
- vel0city 5y ago
  For pretty much all the tap to pay enabled pumps I have used the process was tap payment method, select fuel grade, start pumping. Since this is electric the fuel grade choice would be eliminated. So the process would just be tap payment choice, plug in. Also, most fuel pumps were covered so the idea of negotiating payment in the rain wasn't too much of a concern. It almost seems like a regression to me that most EV charging stations usually have no covers to them.
  - ericd 5y ago
    Really? At least around here, there’s still usually zip code entry, do you want a car wash, do you want a receipt, etc. I’ve also used some tap enabled non Tesla chargers that are on the better end (no app required, just tap payment), but even there, there’re some screens to go through to accept terms, here’s the rate, which is different from other chargers of this type, wait a little while we authorize the charge, alright now you can go. It’s fine, but it’s not totally frictionless like the Tesla method. Again, you all are arguing for making the UX somewhat worse, in order to add flexibility that’s frankly not needed. I encourage you to just try them, if you haven’t, before having a strong opinion about this. Lack of coverings, yeah, but you’re not meant to stand around next to the charger, since they’re not as quick as gas pumps - you can sit in the car, and you’re free to “idle” it, running AC/music/surfing the web, or just go inside whatever venue the charger’s associated with. Also, presumably it makes it a good bit cheaper and quicker to deploy more of these.
    - vel0city 5y ago
      On the pumps I've used, zip code entry is required for swiped cards but I don't recall a time a tap to pay pump has asked me for one. Also often the "Do you want a car wash? Y/N, Do you want a receipt Y/N" screens can often by bypassed by just choosing fuel grade but I do acknowledge some don't continue until you make some selection. That said, I don't go to too many gas stations with car washes on site so that might be the reason why I don't recall getting stuck on those screens very often. Either way, the 5-10 seconds of dealing with a prompt or two on the machine pales in inconvenience of waiting for the car to charge, so much at least in my opinion its a rather inconsequential inconvenience. Cool, you've shaved off 10 seconds so I can hurry up and get to my 20-30min wait for the car to charge. Its not like its really saving me that much more time. I've never in my life thought "dang, my life is so hard, I had to tell the pump I didn't want a car wash. If only someone could come up with a process that would prevent the pump from even asking if I would like a wash, my life would be so much better." And I have used the plug-in and charge process with a Mach E and an EA charger, so its not like I don't know what I'm missing. Its just such a massively inconsequential change in my life and yet it gets billed as the best thing since sliced bread and clearly one of the main reasons why you should pick one expensive car over the other. And as I've mentioned elsewhere, it makes it a lot more complicated to change to a different payment method other than the default you've set up on the account. To change a payment method with traditional pumps, I just use a different card. To change the payment method on a plug and go kind of car, well, that depends on the car and how its account is set up and managed. Also, I get why electric charging stations don't have covers, they're much cheaper to deploy. That said, you're probably going to have your car there longer, there's a higher chance you might be in the car waiting during that time, so it would be really nice especially where I live (Texas) to have that covered. That and while I realize these connectors are designed for it there's something about handling high voltage high amperage power connectors in the rain that makes me quite uncomfortable to plug and unplug in the rain.
kwhitefoot 5y ago
Why should the charging stall need an interface? All the cars have a screen that could be used for that.

by atty 5y ago

ericd 5y ago

Eh there’s usually still some interface to deal with in those systems, here you don’t have to do anything, it probably cuts off more than half of the interaction time. When it’s been pouring rain, I’ve been especially thankful I didn’t have to fumble for a card in my wallet.

vel0city 5y ago
For pretty much all the tap to pay enabled pumps I have used the process was tap payment method, select fuel grade, start pumping. Since this is electric the fuel grade choice would be eliminated. So the process would just be tap payment choice, plug in. Also, most fuel pumps were covered so the idea of negotiating payment in the rain wasn't too much of a concern. It almost seems like a regression to me that most EV charging stations usually have no covers to them.
- ericd 5y ago
  Really? At least around here, there’s still usually zip code entry, do you want a car wash, do you want a receipt, etc. I’ve also used some tap enabled non Tesla chargers that are on the better end (no app required, just tap payment), but even there, there’re some screens to go through to accept terms, here’s the rate, which is different from other chargers of this type, wait a little while we authorize the charge, alright now you can go. It’s fine, but it’s not totally frictionless like the Tesla method. Again, you all are arguing for making the UX somewhat worse, in order to add flexibility that’s frankly not needed. I encourage you to just try them, if you haven’t, before having a strong opinion about this. Lack of coverings, yeah, but you’re not meant to stand around next to the charger, since they’re not as quick as gas pumps - you can sit in the car, and you’re free to “idle” it, running AC/music/surfing the web, or just go inside whatever venue the charger’s associated with. Also, presumably it makes it a good bit cheaper and quicker to deploy more of these.
  - vel0city 5y ago
    On the pumps I've used, zip code entry is required for swiped cards but I don't recall a time a tap to pay pump has asked me for one. Also often the "Do you want a car wash? Y/N, Do you want a receipt Y/N" screens can often by bypassed by just choosing fuel grade but I do acknowledge some don't continue until you make some selection. That said, I don't go to too many gas stations with car washes on site so that might be the reason why I don't recall getting stuck on those screens very often. Either way, the 5-10 seconds of dealing with a prompt or two on the machine pales in inconvenience of waiting for the car to charge, so much at least in my opinion its a rather inconsequential inconvenience. Cool, you've shaved off 10 seconds so I can hurry up and get to my 20-30min wait for the car to charge. Its not like its really saving me that much more time. I've never in my life thought "dang, my life is so hard, I had to tell the pump I didn't want a car wash. If only someone could come up with a process that would prevent the pump from even asking if I would like a wash, my life would be so much better." And I have used the plug-in and charge process with a Mach E and an EA charger, so its not like I don't know what I'm missing. Its just such a massively inconsequential change in my life and yet it gets billed as the best thing since sliced bread and clearly one of the main reasons why you should pick one expensive car over the other. And as I've mentioned elsewhere, it makes it a lot more complicated to change to a different payment method other than the default you've set up on the account. To change a payment method with traditional pumps, I just use a different card. To change the payment method on a plug and go kind of car, well, that depends on the car and how its account is set up and managed. Also, I get why electric charging stations don't have covers, they're much cheaper to deploy. That said, you're probably going to have your car there longer, there's a higher chance you might be in the car waiting during that time, so it would be really nice especially where I live (Texas) to have that covered. That and while I realize these connectors are designed for it there's something about handling high voltage high amperage power connectors in the rain that makes me quite uncomfortable to plug and unplug in the rain.

kwhitefoot 5y ago

Why should the charging stall need an interface? All the cars have a screen that could be used for that.