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I don’t see anything in the article that claims an actual SWAT team was deployed here, or that the police did anything wrong or irresponsible. There was a repo

I don’t see anything in the article that claims an actual SWAT team was deployed here, or that the police did anything wrong or irresponsible. There was a report of an armed gunman who had already killed someone on this guy’s property, so cops went to search for him. What exactly would you have them do differently?

ceejayoz 5y ago
> "He went out the house with a gun, because he heard someone was on his property," Fitch explained. "He sees all these cops around him, and they ask if he is Mark Herring, 'put your hands up,' so he tosses the gun away from him to show he's not a threat, and [put his] hands up." If not a SWAT team, a large armed response.
- PragmaticPulp 5y ago
  What do you propose as an alternative? They can’t send unarmed cops to respond to reports of gun violence, and it wouldn’t be responsible to simply send one cop. By all accounts, the police responded appropriately and de-escalating the situation when the man came outside with a gun. I don’t understand what people want to be different about this situation, other than for the police to become clairvoyant so they can know when reports are false before they get there.
  - coldtea 5y ago
    >What do you propose as an alternative? From the police that regularly chokes people, shots unarmed men, women, and even kids, and likes to play with military gear, and are trigger happy? Probably one can't expect much of them, anyway. A competent police would have set up some kind of barricade to stand behind, call for the person to come out, try to watch the house from afar to see what's going on, and in any case, not have several people stand with drawn weapons aiming at a person...
    - beervirus 5y ago
      Yes, when there's a report that a gunman has already shot someone, the police should respond by... hiding.
      - coldtea 5y ago
        Of course not, they should respond Hollywood-style, so that they create chaos and even more people get a chance to be shot, Mexican Standoff style. After all if "a gunman has already shot someone", the police can obviously bring that person back to life by charging into the scene guns ablazing... And, as many SWATing cases have shown us, "when there's a report that a gunman has already shot someone" it's necessarily true! /s
  - trhway 5y ago
    >What do you propose as an alternative Send the drones ahead. Flying, walking, tracked, wheeling.
    - cortesoft 5y ago
      Like that wouldn’t cause a heart attack?
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
    - xaedes 5y ago
      Why send the officers at all and risk their lifes, can't we just install weapons on the drones? Oh yea we probably can. dramatic evil music starts
  - denton-scratch 5y ago
    > it wouldn’t be responsible to simply send one cop Does that even happen in the USA? I'm in the UK, and I can't remember the last time I saw a solitary cop - they patrol in pairs here.
    - throwaway0a5e 5y ago
      For low priority stuff it's common enough I'd say it's the standard.
    - Ichthypresbyter 5y ago
      I've heard serving UK police officers elsewhere online say that their department's standard response to reports of hostage situations is to send one officer to drive past the premises in either an unmarked car or their personal car* to see if the report checks out. In general, cuts to the police have made single crewing a lot more common. *With the exception of dog handlers, British police aren't allowed to drive home in their patrol cars.
  - rchaud 5y ago
    > By all accounts, the police responded appropriately and de-escalating the situation when the man came outside with a gun. Whose accounts would those be of? Is there a video available for review? The original Minneapolis PD's report on George Floyd was the only official account of the events prior to the medical examiner's report, and was specifically written to be as detail-free as legally possible. https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a36179698/minneapolis-police-first-statement-george-floyd/ https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a36179698/minneapolis-...
jdally987 5y ago
We’re clear here that that was just what the kid said, all made up right? And no one was actually killed prior to the swat showing up. The article was written pretty confusingly.. anyway sounded to me like the guy was literally just sitting around and happened to have a gun, as you probably would in a rural area, and went into fight or flight once the neighbor told him he was surrounded by armed cops But I would think - depending on whether prank reports like this are relatively common, as a % of all SWAT calls made legitimate or illegitimate - it’d be better to check out the scene, maybe even knock first if the situation allows it, as a default, to determine any chance that they were just being sent on a wild goose chase by some bored gamers. I guess cases with quote-unquote hostages would preclude that kind of luxury though, dunno
- cortesoft 5y ago
  It sounds like the police did a fairly rational thing here. They went to the house in a large group, they asked for the person, told him to out down his weapon, and didn’t shoot him. That sounds like a reasonable response, even though it ended in tragedy. The only people responsible for this were the people who called the police with a false report. That is the crime. I think cops do a lot of bad shit and need to be held accountable, but this sounds like they did the right thing.
katbyte 5y ago
i dunno but "swatting" seems like a decidedly american thing so how come its not a problem in other countries?
- perl4ever 5y ago
  You're asking this on an American-centric forum, secure in the knowledge most Americans aren't paying attention to issues with the police in other countries.
  - katbyte 5y ago
    no i'm responding to someone acting like "there is no other way to handle this" who's clearly not considered that other countries handle it rather differently
    - unishark 5y ago
      The person saying there was no way to handle it differently was talking about the specific case in this article where we know the details and can consider each of the police's actions logically using common sense.
- mcguire 5y ago
  What happens in your country when the police receive an anonymous phone call about a violent crime in progress at a residence?
  - skinkestek 5y ago
    For whatever reason I very rarely hear about swat-like behavior from the Norwegian police, and it is not because media leave them alone. I hear about unnecessary use of force while detaining someone, a few standoffs against armed opponents, a few car chases but nothing like swatting.
    - spfzero 5y ago

ceejayoz 5y ago

> "He went out the house with a gun, because he heard someone was on his property," Fitch explained. "He sees all these cops around him, and they ask if he is Mark Herring, 'put your hands up,' so he tosses the gun away from him to show he's not a threat, and [put his] hands up." If not a SWAT team, a large armed response.

PragmaticPulp 5y ago
What do you propose as an alternative? They can’t send unarmed cops to respond to reports of gun violence, and it wouldn’t be responsible to simply send one cop. By all accounts, the police responded appropriately and de-escalating the situation when the man came outside with a gun. I don’t understand what people want to be different about this situation, other than for the police to become clairvoyant so they can know when reports are false before they get there.
- coldtea 5y ago
  >What do you propose as an alternative? From the police that regularly chokes people, shots unarmed men, women, and even kids, and likes to play with military gear, and are trigger happy? Probably one can't expect much of them, anyway. A competent police would have set up some kind of barricade to stand behind, call for the person to come out, try to watch the house from afar to see what's going on, and in any case, not have several people stand with drawn weapons aiming at a person...
  - beervirus 5y ago
    Yes, when there's a report that a gunman has already shot someone, the police should respond by... hiding.
    - coldtea 5y ago
      Of course not, they should respond Hollywood-style, so that they create chaos and even more people get a chance to be shot, Mexican Standoff style. After all if "a gunman has already shot someone", the police can obviously bring that person back to life by charging into the scene guns ablazing... And, as many SWATing cases have shown us, "when there's a report that a gunman has already shot someone" it's necessarily true! /s
- trhway 5y ago
  >What do you propose as an alternative Send the drones ahead. Flying, walking, tracked, wheeling.
  - cortesoft 5y ago
    Like that wouldn’t cause a heart attack?
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
  - xaedes 5y ago
    Why send the officers at all and risk their lifes, can't we just install weapons on the drones? Oh yea we probably can. dramatic evil music starts
- denton-scratch 5y ago
  > it wouldn’t be responsible to simply send one cop Does that even happen in the USA? I'm in the UK, and I can't remember the last time I saw a solitary cop - they patrol in pairs here.
  - throwaway0a5e 5y ago
    For low priority stuff it's common enough I'd say it's the standard.
  - Ichthypresbyter 5y ago
    I've heard serving UK police officers elsewhere online say that their department's standard response to reports of hostage situations is to send one officer to drive past the premises in either an unmarked car or their personal car* to see if the report checks out. In general, cuts to the police have made single crewing a lot more common. *With the exception of dog handlers, British police aren't allowed to drive home in their patrol cars.
- rchaud 5y ago
  > By all accounts, the police responded appropriately and de-escalating the situation when the man came outside with a gun. Whose accounts would those be of? Is there a video available for review? The original Minneapolis PD's report on George Floyd was the only official account of the events prior to the medical examiner's report, and was specifically written to be as detail-free as legally possible. https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a36179698/minneapolis-police-first-statement-george-floyd/ https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/a36179698/minneapolis-...

jdally987 5y ago

We’re clear here that that was just what the kid said, all made up right? And no one was actually killed prior to the swat showing up. The article was written pretty confusingly.. anyway sounded to me like the guy was literally just sitting around and happened to have a gun, as you probably would in a rural area, and went into fight or flight once the neighbor told him he was surrounded by armed cops But I would think - depending on whether prank reports like this are relatively common, as a % of all SWAT calls made legitimate or illegitimate - it’d be better to check out the scene, maybe even knock first if the situation allows it, as a default, to determine any chance that they were just being sent on a wild goose chase by some bored gamers. I guess cases with quote-unquote hostages would preclude that kind of luxury though, dunno

cortesoft 5y ago
It sounds like the police did a fairly rational thing here. They went to the house in a large group, they asked for the person, told him to out down his weapon, and didn’t shoot him. That sounds like a reasonable response, even though it ended in tragedy. The only people responsible for this were the people who called the police with a false report. That is the crime. I think cops do a lot of bad shit and need to be held accountable, but this sounds like they did the right thing.

katbyte 5y ago

i dunno but "swatting" seems like a decidedly american thing so how come its not a problem in other countries?

perl4ever 5y ago
You're asking this on an American-centric forum, secure in the knowledge most Americans aren't paying attention to issues with the police in other countries.
- katbyte 5y ago
  no i'm responding to someone acting like "there is no other way to handle this" who's clearly not considered that other countries handle it rather differently
  - unishark 5y ago
    The person saying there was no way to handle it differently was talking about the specific case in this article where we know the details and can consider each of the police's actions logically using common sense.
mcguire 5y ago
What happens in your country when the police receive an anonymous phone call about a violent crime in progress at a residence?
- skinkestek 5y ago
  For whatever reason I very rarely hear about swat-like behavior from the Norwegian police, and it is not because media leave them alone. I hear about unnecessary use of force while detaining someone, a few standoffs against armed opponents, a few car chases but nothing like swatting.
  - spfzero 5y ago