3 ms·

I'm not sure a waiter at a good steakhouse is making a good living. It's been a while since I worked food service, so I might be making some poor assumptions, b

by greedo 5y ago

I'm not sure a waiter at a good steakhouse is making a good living. It's been a while since I worked food service, so I might be making some poor assumptions, but: 1. Most waiters don't get health benefits 2. Most waiters don't get retirement plans 3. Most waiters are at the whim of the restaurant managers 4. There's only so many tables you can turn in a shift, and tips average under 20%. 5. Most waiters don't get any PTO Say you have a four-top that has meal service of $120 (booze tips usually go to cocktail waitresses, wine goes to waiter). An average section for a "good" steakhouse will have no more than 5 tables per waiter; otherwise service sucks. So each table earns the waiter $24 in tips. With 5 tables, that's $120 per turn. High end steakhouses don't turn fast; again, the appeal is having a long, hearty meal. So maybe 2.5 turns on a good night. That would be $300 in tips. But then you have to tip out. Busboy gets $25 (helps you turn faster, helps with some service), dishwasher gets $10 (should get $100), hostess gets $20 (so your section gets sat promptly), and at least $50 for the line cooks who are the real stars. Now you're done to $195. That needs to be reported as income, so it gets held back by mgmt for tax. You get 3 good shifts a week, and 2 crap shifts. After a week you've made $195x3 plus $125x2 for a grand total (pretax) of $835/week. So your gross is $44K. I'm ignoring the base hourly wage because it's usually nothing. $44k isn't bad money. It's above the nationwide median, but considering all the downsides, it's not "a good living." If you get sick, tough shit you lose out. If the chef jacks up the menu, you lose out. And it's a young person's gig. People want their waiters to be young and attractive, not balding and showing grey hairs.

fragmede 5y ago
Your numbered points stand - no healthcare, no retirement, or other benefits a FAANG employee would have, but your numbers are low for a high end restaurant. A good steakhouse for 4 might cost closer to $500, $800 for just food at the highest end, with booze being another couple hundred on top of that. And then there's the cash aspect of it. Each night's tips are required to be declared to the IRS, and not reporting it would be tax fraud, but the reality is I'm sure not everything gets reported, boosting take home amounts, making the numbers incomparable without further analysis. I've heard of bartenders making more than $100k/yr, (but still with no benefits).
- greedo 5y ago
  A "good steakhouse" doesn't charge $200 per customer unless it's selling Kobe/Wagyu. And the percentage of customers buying Wagyu over the $50 ribeye is very small.
  - kelnos 5y ago
    Even with the $50 ribeye, that four-top is still generating $200 on food per turn, more than the grandparent's original $120 estimate. Maybe my view is skewed from seeing prices in expensive cities, but I think the beef alone at a good steakhouse is gonna run you more like $75-$100 per person, and that's not even for the high-end wagyu (which will probably run $150-$250 for most cuts). Then add another $10-$30 per person for appetizers and side dishes, and maybe dessert on top of that. I feel like it's pretty hard to walk away from a good steakhouse spending less than $80 or so, even if you have nothing to drink. And the more common case is probably quite a bit more than that...
Spooky23 5y ago
> It's above the nationwide median, but considering all the downsides, it's not "a good living." I think well educated professionals sometime miss what reality is for millions of people. $44k for a few shifts is better and more reliable income than a retail gig. The similar premium gig for a low skill person is probably a janitor.
- greedo 5y ago
  For a few shifts? That's five shifts, and usually a good eight hours each. And the income is sporadic; during the offseason (in tourist areas) your income might be halved.
holidaygoose 5y ago
Even with your understated numbers, with everything being as worse as possible, you ended up with a pretty decent wage for 5 evenings of work. In reality, half of the US population lives in a state with a regular minimum wage for waiters (California, New York, Washington, and a bunch of other states), and the other half averages $5/hr which is $7800/yr if you work 30 hours a week. Also there's cash tips that aren't reported on taxes. And like others have said, you're estimating $30/person at a steakhouse which is TGI Fridays prices. Put that together, and you're looking at the equivalent of six figures pre-tax for 5 nights of work, with no email at night or on-call. Sounds pretty good to me.
- Ccecil 5y ago
  Not reporting tips on taxes only hurts the waitstaff even more. It blocks you from being able to get loans/credit. Reporting them and keeping track of them then paying your taxes at the end of the year is the only way...but of course that assumes the bank doesn't deem your income as "not steady/stable" because of course...it isn't a salary. In my area some waitstaff also make $3.50/hr because the company assumes they make tips. Some also hold all your credit card tips and give them to you on the paycheck...so it isn't all roses.
- gammarator 5y ago
  Restaurants are hiring if you want the job…

by greedo 5y ago

fragmede 5y ago

Your numbered points stand - no healthcare, no retirement, or other benefits a FAANG employee would have, but your numbers are low for a high end restaurant. A good steakhouse for 4 might cost closer to $500, $800 for just food at the highest end, with booze being another couple hundred on top of that. And then there's the cash aspect of it. Each night's tips are required to be declared to the IRS, and not reporting it would be tax fraud, but the reality is I'm sure not everything gets reported, boosting take home amounts, making the numbers incomparable without further analysis. I've heard of bartenders making more than $100k/yr, (but still with no benefits).

greedo 5y ago
A "good steakhouse" doesn't charge $200 per customer unless it's selling Kobe/Wagyu. And the percentage of customers buying Wagyu over the $50 ribeye is very small.
- kelnos 5y ago
  Even with the $50 ribeye, that four-top is still generating $200 on food per turn, more than the grandparent's original $120 estimate. Maybe my view is skewed from seeing prices in expensive cities, but I think the beef alone at a good steakhouse is gonna run you more like $75-$100 per person, and that's not even for the high-end wagyu (which will probably run $150-$250 for most cuts). Then add another $10-$30 per person for appetizers and side dishes, and maybe dessert on top of that. I feel like it's pretty hard to walk away from a good steakhouse spending less than $80 or so, even if you have nothing to drink. And the more common case is probably quite a bit more than that...

Spooky23 5y ago

> It's above the nationwide median, but considering all the downsides, it's not "a good living." I think well educated professionals sometime miss what reality is for millions of people. $44k for a few shifts is better and more reliable income than a retail gig. The similar premium gig for a low skill person is probably a janitor.

greedo 5y ago
For a few shifts? That's five shifts, and usually a good eight hours each. And the income is sporadic; during the offseason (in tourist areas) your income might be halved.

holidaygoose 5y ago

Even with your understated numbers, with everything being as worse as possible, you ended up with a pretty decent wage for 5 evenings of work. In reality, half of the US population lives in a state with a regular minimum wage for waiters (California, New York, Washington, and a bunch of other states), and the other half averages $5/hr which is $7800/yr if you work 30 hours a week. Also there's cash tips that aren't reported on taxes. And like others have said, you're estimating $30/person at a steakhouse which is TGI Fridays prices. Put that together, and you're looking at the equivalent of six figures pre-tax for 5 nights of work, with no email at night or on-call. Sounds pretty good to me.

Ccecil 5y ago
Not reporting tips on taxes only hurts the waitstaff even more. It blocks you from being able to get loans/credit. Reporting them and keeping track of them then paying your taxes at the end of the year is the only way...but of course that assumes the bank doesn't deem your income as "not steady/stable" because of course...it isn't a salary. In my area some waitstaff also make $3.50/hr because the company assumes they make tips. Some also hold all your credit card tips and give them to you on the paycheck...so it isn't all roses.
gammarator 5y ago
Restaurants are hiring if you want the job…