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The US has world-class train service for freight. The lower population density of the US than Europe and East Asia makes planes a better investment in the US. L

The US has world-class train service for freight. The lower population density of the US than Europe and East Asia makes planes a better investment in the US. Less rail to lay per person server makes a big difference.

bluGill 5y ago
The midwest of the US has similar population density to France. The western half of the US with few people (not to mention Alaska) really skew the population density.
- jcranmer 5y ago
  By way of Alon Levy's blog (although original credit goes to a Twitter user), here's the TGV overlaid on the Midwest: https://twitter.com/Artifact_Scott/status/1377702867944009737 https://twitter.com/Artifact_Scott/status/137770286794400973... The major Midwestern cities are remarkably close in distance from Chicago as major French cities are from Paris, and in terms of population counts, the US has consistently larger cities.
  - multiplegeorges 5y ago
    Sure, but the problem is what do you do once you get there? In France, the cities are dense with decent to great transit. In the US, you have low, flat, sprawling cities with no real transit to speak of. You have to drive.
    - clairity 5y ago
      > "...what do you do once you get there?" car rental, ridehailing, metro bus/train, taxi, friends/family pickup, etc., just as with air travel.
    - gsnedders 5y ago
      This is why looking at the current number of aviation passengers on these routes that's often the most valuable thing. It shows where people think the time savings justify hiring a car/taking taxis. Clearly not having overheads of airport security will probably reduce the minimum distance required for this, but as a first pass it's good data source.
    - soperj 5y ago
      Same thing with planes except you start way outside the city.
    - bluGill 5y ago
      I have long said that we need to work on local transit before we work on HSR, but in truth the two do compliment each other. All cities of any size at all have at least a small amount of useful local transit. Expand the local system and make it useful would be a great investment and HSR will make it more useful. Most local transit systems are run by people who drive though, and it shows in how bad the majority of the system is.
mimixco 5y ago
It's interesting that Amazon (who spends a fortune on trucking) has created their own cargo airline and starting buying metal because it works out better for them than paying a trucking company. They make money on fast turnaround and big distribution warehouses close to population centers, then they truck the last mile with their own vans. Historically, the cheapest ways to ship anything are by sea, by rail, and by truck, in that order. Airplanes are still inordinately more expensive but folks are willing to pay for that quick delivery that trucks and rail simply can't do.

bluGill 5y ago

The midwest of the US has similar population density to France. The western half of the US with few people (not to mention Alaska) really skew the population density.

jcranmer 5y ago
By way of Alon Levy's blog (although original credit goes to a Twitter user), here's the TGV overlaid on the Midwest: https://twitter.com/Artifact_Scott/status/1377702867944009737 https://twitter.com/Artifact_Scott/status/137770286794400973... The major Midwestern cities are remarkably close in distance from Chicago as major French cities are from Paris, and in terms of population counts, the US has consistently larger cities.
- multiplegeorges 5y ago
  Sure, but the problem is what do you do once you get there? In France, the cities are dense with decent to great transit. In the US, you have low, flat, sprawling cities with no real transit to speak of. You have to drive.
  - clairity 5y ago
    > "...what do you do once you get there?" car rental, ridehailing, metro bus/train, taxi, friends/family pickup, etc., just as with air travel.
  - gsnedders 5y ago
    This is why looking at the current number of aviation passengers on these routes that's often the most valuable thing. It shows where people think the time savings justify hiring a car/taking taxis. Clearly not having overheads of airport security will probably reduce the minimum distance required for this, but as a first pass it's good data source.
  - soperj 5y ago
    Same thing with planes except you start way outside the city.
  - bluGill 5y ago
    I have long said that we need to work on local transit before we work on HSR, but in truth the two do compliment each other. All cities of any size at all have at least a small amount of useful local transit. Expand the local system and make it useful would be a great investment and HSR will make it more useful. Most local transit systems are run by people who drive though, and it shows in how bad the majority of the system is.

mimixco 5y ago

It's interesting that Amazon (who spends a fortune on trucking) has created their own cargo airline and starting buying metal because it works out better for them than paying a trucking company. They make money on fast turnaround and big distribution warehouses close to population centers, then they truck the last mile with their own vans. Historically, the cheapest ways to ship anything are by sea, by rail, and by truck, in that order. Airplanes are still inordinately more expensive but folks are willing to pay for that quick delivery that trucks and rail simply can't do.