5 ms·

According to the article, Germany is also looking to build one... Just assign the task to the Deutsche Bahn, what could possibly go wrong! Before corona times,

According to the article, Germany is also looking to build one... Just assign the task to the Deutsche Bahn, what could possibly go wrong! Before corona times, there used to be stations closing because too many people are called in sick or at vacation. Trains stopping in the middle of nowhere and conductor announcing, "eerm, yeah, we are having technical difficulties" and you just sit there for at least an hour without any updates. Not sure how it is now but...

ginko 5y ago
I think they're referring to the Transrapid, which essentially got scrapped. The only non-test track ever built is in Shanghai.
- sudosysgen 5y ago
  No, this is a completely new design. The ultimate goal is for rail transport to be faster than air transport and build it to connect Shanghai and Beijing. Transrapid was never going to be built on a large scale, it wasn't a domestic design and it wasn't fast enough to be a real alternative to air transport. Perhaps this iteration even won't be, but eventually there will almost certainly be such a line built - the need is too great.
  - ginko 5y ago
    I was referring to the one Germany was working on. I know that the 600 kph train presented in this article isn't a Transrapid.
    - sudosysgen 5y ago
      Ah ok sorry, because the previous maglev train in China is also a Transrapid :P
  - rob74 5y ago
    Completely new? If you look at how Transrapid trains "hug" the rail from both above and below (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid#/media/File:Transrapid_07_Muenchen_Airport_Center.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid#/media/File:Transra...), the train in the picture is doing exactly the same. So I would be a bit skeptical about such claims...
    - sudosysgen 5y ago
      That is indeed the basic design of a maglev train. If you look closely, you will see that almost every maglev train "hugs" the tracks from above and below. This is necessary to prevent the train from derailing and everyone on board from dying. Some use different means of not derailling but surrounding the rail is the simplest.
      - rob74 5y ago
        Not any maglev train. According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maglev https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maglev, there are three different types, and even the EMS type can have some variation ("single beam" or "double beam": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HSST-Double-Beam.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HSST-Double-Beam.png). I'm not sure which type is more widespread though (since none of them can really be called "widespread").
        sudosysgen 5y ago
        Even dual beam EMS looks exactly the same : https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Speed_Surface_Transport#/media/File%3AYES89-HSST.jpg https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Speed_Surface_Transport... There aren't three different types of Maglev systems. There's EMS and EDS. Indutrack is a type of EDS.
gruez 5y ago
I thought German trains were supposed to be super punctual? Or is that Japan?
- Kelteseth 5y ago
  No. Swiss trains are, but German trains are famous for being late. A little snow in the winter? Well, guess what: Schienenersatzverkehr! (Rail replacement bus service)
  - rsynnott 5y ago
    I mean, it's all a question of perspective. The sort of train delay that's objectionable in Germany is so normal that no-one would even notice it in Ireland, say. Irish Rail defines punctuality as within 10 minutes of schedule for intercity and within 5 minutes of schedule for commuter and metro. Based on that rather generous definition, most lines manage 90-95% punctuality...
    - bluGill 5y ago
      Just because some places are worse doesn't mean we should excuse Germany. Trains should be within 5 seconds every single time. With dedicated infrastructure and absolute priority this isn't hard. (I'll make an exception only if the wind is faster than 200km/h, or earthquakes - every other weather event should be normal and designed out - the exact wind speed can be debated of course). It goes without saying that collisions are not acceptable.
    - JumpCrisscross 5y ago
      > sort of train delay that's objectionable in Germany is so normal that no-one would even notice it in Ireland New Yorker here. I noticed. Germany's trains were erratically delayed in a way that was frustrating, noticeable and opaque. Our LIRR and Metro North, on the other hand, run on time. As did Trenitalia when I was traveling from Roma to Napoli last week.
    - rob74 5y ago
      We have that in Germany too. Any delay between 0 and 4 minutes 59 seconds is "no delay". Any delay between 5:00 and 9:59 is "5 minutes". Any delay between 10:00 and 14:59 is "10 minutes", and so on... In Germany the whole fiasco started with the "privatisation" of the Federal Railways (Bundesbahn) in the mid-nineties. Since then, Deutsche Bahn behaves like a private company, but is still 100% owned by the federal government (who sometimes taps them for money), and is three things at once: train operator (in which role it competes with other operators), infrastructure owner (in which role it sells track usage rights to itself and other operators) and station owner (in which role it sells station usage rights to itself and other operators, plus makes a lot of money as landlord at bigger stations while neglecting smaller ones). Which leads to all kinds of conflicts of interest. Mainly, DB is "profit-oriented", i.e. it tends to dislike investing any of its own money in infrastructure expansion or maintenance - all such works must be requested and paid by either the federal government or the state (Bundesland) governments. And since these governments hate to be seen as "subsidizing" a "private company", most of the infrastructure (except for a few shiny new projects that make politicians look good) is just languishing in the state it was almost 30 years ago, with minimal maintenance.
FabHK 5y ago
FWIW, Germany did build a maglev that runs up to 500 km/h, the "Transrapid" [1]. Development was started in 1969, and a test route was built in 1987. However, it was only ever deployed in production once, in 2002 - guess where? In Shanghai, connecting the Pudong airport to downtown (Correction: Not downtown, but to an interchange station connecting to a few metro lines.) And hey presto, 20 years later China has a maglev. Honi soit qui mal y pense [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honi_soit_qui_mal_y_pense https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honi_soit_qui_mal_y_pense
- larusso 5y ago
  Yes I wanted to comment the same. And Germany is, as far as I know no longer looking into this anymore. Edit: I mean for the usage in Germany. It’s sadly a very political topic because lots of money went into this project.
  - FabHK 5y ago
    Yes, it is a pity. On the other hand, Germany is only around 1000 km north to south, and most distances can be done in a few hours with conventional high speed trains. And it doesn't look like there'll be export opportunities for a Transrapid anytime soon to, say, the US, or China...
    - bluGill 5y ago
      If you limit yourself to Germany you are correct. However the EU is a thing, and could be made a lot better if the countries started acting together more. Maglev from Italy to Finland with stops in Germany for example.
      - giantrobot 5y ago
        The Alps would have a word.
        5y ago
IceHegel 5y ago
That’s the way the cookie crumbles when you ride Deutsche Bahn.

ginko 5y ago

I think they're referring to the Transrapid, which essentially got scrapped. The only non-test track ever built is in Shanghai.

sudosysgen 5y ago
No, this is a completely new design. The ultimate goal is for rail transport to be faster than air transport and build it to connect Shanghai and Beijing. Transrapid was never going to be built on a large scale, it wasn't a domestic design and it wasn't fast enough to be a real alternative to air transport. Perhaps this iteration even won't be, but eventually there will almost certainly be such a line built - the need is too great.
- ginko 5y ago
  I was referring to the one Germany was working on. I know that the 600 kph train presented in this article isn't a Transrapid.
  - sudosysgen 5y ago
    Ah ok sorry, because the previous maglev train in China is also a Transrapid :P
- rob74 5y ago
  Completely new? If you look at how Transrapid trains "hug" the rail from both above and below (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid#/media/File:Transrapid_07_Muenchen_Airport_Center.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid#/media/File:Transra...), the train in the picture is doing exactly the same. So I would be a bit skeptical about such claims...
  - sudosysgen 5y ago
    That is indeed the basic design of a maglev train. If you look closely, you will see that almost every maglev train "hugs" the tracks from above and below. This is necessary to prevent the train from derailing and everyone on board from dying. Some use different means of not derailling but surrounding the rail is the simplest.
    - rob74 5y ago
      Not any maglev train. According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maglev https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maglev, there are three different types, and even the EMS type can have some variation ("single beam" or "double beam": https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HSST-Double-Beam.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:HSST-Double-Beam.png). I'm not sure which type is more widespread though (since none of them can really be called "widespread").
      - sudosysgen 5y ago
        Even dual beam EMS looks exactly the same : https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Speed_Surface_Transport#/media/File%3AYES89-HSST.jpg https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Speed_Surface_Transport... There aren't three different types of Maglev systems. There's EMS and EDS. Indutrack is a type of EDS.

gruez 5y ago

I thought German trains were supposed to be super punctual? Or is that Japan?

Kelteseth 5y ago
No. Swiss trains are, but German trains are famous for being late. A little snow in the winter? Well, guess what: Schienenersatzverkehr! (Rail replacement bus service)
- rsynnott 5y ago
  I mean, it's all a question of perspective. The sort of train delay that's objectionable in Germany is so normal that no-one would even notice it in Ireland, say. Irish Rail defines punctuality as within 10 minutes of schedule for intercity and within 5 minutes of schedule for commuter and metro. Based on that rather generous definition, most lines manage 90-95% punctuality...
  - bluGill 5y ago
    Just because some places are worse doesn't mean we should excuse Germany. Trains should be within 5 seconds every single time. With dedicated infrastructure and absolute priority this isn't hard. (I'll make an exception only if the wind is faster than 200km/h, or earthquakes - every other weather event should be normal and designed out - the exact wind speed can be debated of course). It goes without saying that collisions are not acceptable.
  - JumpCrisscross 5y ago
    > sort of train delay that's objectionable in Germany is so normal that no-one would even notice it in Ireland New Yorker here. I noticed. Germany's trains were erratically delayed in a way that was frustrating, noticeable and opaque. Our LIRR and Metro North, on the other hand, run on time. As did Trenitalia when I was traveling from Roma to Napoli last week.
  - rob74 5y ago
    We have that in Germany too. Any delay between 0 and 4 minutes 59 seconds is "no delay". Any delay between 5:00 and 9:59 is "5 minutes". Any delay between 10:00 and 14:59 is "10 minutes", and so on... In Germany the whole fiasco started with the "privatisation" of the Federal Railways (Bundesbahn) in the mid-nineties. Since then, Deutsche Bahn behaves like a private company, but is still 100% owned by the federal government (who sometimes taps them for money), and is three things at once: train operator (in which role it competes with other operators), infrastructure owner (in which role it sells track usage rights to itself and other operators) and station owner (in which role it sells station usage rights to itself and other operators, plus makes a lot of money as landlord at bigger stations while neglecting smaller ones). Which leads to all kinds of conflicts of interest. Mainly, DB is "profit-oriented", i.e. it tends to dislike investing any of its own money in infrastructure expansion or maintenance - all such works must be requested and paid by either the federal government or the state (Bundesland) governments. And since these governments hate to be seen as "subsidizing" a "private company", most of the infrastructure (except for a few shiny new projects that make politicians look good) is just languishing in the state it was almost 30 years ago, with minimal maintenance.

FabHK 5y ago

FWIW, Germany did build a maglev that runs up to 500 km/h, the "Transrapid" [1]. Development was started in 1969, and a test route was built in 1987. However, it was only ever deployed in production once, in 2002 - guess where? In Shanghai, connecting the Pudong airport to downtown (Correction: Not downtown, but to an interchange station connecting to a few metro lines.) And hey presto, 20 years later China has a maglev. Honi soit qui mal y pense [2]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transrapid [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honi_soit_qui_mal_y_pense https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honi_soit_qui_mal_y_pense

larusso 5y ago
Yes I wanted to comment the same. And Germany is, as far as I know no longer looking into this anymore. Edit: I mean for the usage in Germany. It’s sadly a very political topic because lots of money went into this project.
- FabHK 5y ago
  Yes, it is a pity. On the other hand, Germany is only around 1000 km north to south, and most distances can be done in a few hours with conventional high speed trains. And it doesn't look like there'll be export opportunities for a Transrapid anytime soon to, say, the US, or China...
  - bluGill 5y ago
    If you limit yourself to Germany you are correct. However the EU is a thing, and could be made a lot better if the countries started acting together more. Maglev from Italy to Finland with stops in Germany for example.
    - giantrobot 5y ago
      The Alps would have a word.
      - 5y ago

IceHegel 5y ago

That’s the way the cookie crumbles when you ride Deutsche Bahn.