8 ms·

EU is as helpless as USA. what would US of A do with a rogue Texas? nothing

by underscore_ku 5y ago

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
nix23 5y ago
The EU is not a state...thank god for that, and that it never happens.
- johnnycerberus 5y ago
  But it can be a federation of states. Hopefully, that will happen.
  - nix23 5y ago
    Depends how much the states have their own freedom and power (financial marketplace, and military), remember Russia is a federation too.
  - bluthund 5y ago
    Hopefully that never happens. Hopefully more Hungary's emerge. Hopefully more Western countries start actually serving their people Hopefully nationalism crushes this perverse anti Western virus which has taken over the once greatest nations in the world
    - egeozcan 5y ago
      In this day and age, don't people like you read/watch some world history? What you are saying seems so narrow-minded (ignoring the racist undertone), it makes me confused.
      - bluthund 5y ago
        It's precisely a studying and understanding of history which makes me so. Perhaps people like you would do better to engage in conversation where you might learn something you don't know rather than throw out your classic epithets
        egeozcan 5y ago
        So, to be clear, you studied and "understood" history and came to the conclusion that nationalism is a good thing. How? It's clear that I don't agree with you. I think you must be too isolated from some nice people to be so furious about other people.
        bluthund 5y ago
        We can circle back to the psycho analysis later if you so desire, but I'll be sticking to the topic at hand for the time being. You seem to have made a connection between nationalism and being furious about other people. I respectfully disagree that there is a necessary relationship there. I have no ill will against other people. I would like people who share my culture to govern me, and I would not like people of my culture governing people of a different culture. They can govern themselves and we can govern ourselves. We can share ideas, trade, sport, etc., But multiculturalism within borders is an inevitable failure and globalism is an inevitable failure
        egeozcan 5y ago
        > I would like people who share my culture to govern me, and I would not like people of my culture governing people of a different culture. When did this ever happen in history? People diverge all the time, that's how we have so many cultures.
        nix23 5y ago
        >People diverge all the time, that's how we have so many cultures. Lightly categorized in so called country's?
        5y ago
    - johnnycerberus 5y ago
      I'm certain that every Romanian sees Vitkor Orban as a wolf in sheep's clothing. The protector of interests for V4 group through unethical means and corrupted politicians. Hopefully, sanctions will follow soon. Masking local interests of a few corrupted individuals with nationalism is borderline criminal.
    - nix23 5y ago
      >Hopefully nationalism crushes this perverse anti Western virus Being totally against the EU, i think full on nationalism is wrong too. We life on one big spaceship and with that, we should have one organizing (not governing entity) like the UN was once meant to be.
      - johnnycerberus 5y ago
        EU is built on the European thought at least, it is the child of Christianity, strongly influenced by Greco-Roman world sprinkled with some Germanic austerity. No wonder why countries with Muslim minorities cannot join the Union. UN would never work because what binds Europe together is exactly this shared Christian past starting from the division of Catholic and Orthodox Church and ending with Protestant thought. Even if our European elite act as religion does not play a role anymore that is simply not true. Christianity is the most enduring and influential legacy of the ancient world, and its emergence the single most transformative development in Western history. Even the increasing number in the West today who have abandoned the faith of their forebears, and dismiss all religion as pointless superstition, remain recognisably its heirs. From Western France to Eastern Romania, the legacy can be felt in everything, from language to cuisine, from architecture to music. Imagine that those countries are on opposite sides of the EU but they both speak a Romance language.
        nix23 5y ago
        >No wonder why countries with Muslim minorities cannot join the Union. Germany has a Muslim minority. And Cyprus has 25%. I don't think Religion is a point here at all, culture definitely is.
        trasz 5y ago
        You do realize that Islam is essentially a Christianity’s sequel, right? Also, your mistaking Christianity - which is doing just fine in the western world, probably better than ever - with its degenerate form of fundamentalist groups, based mostly on hate, eg homophobia. This is most visible in Poland - which is very Catholic, and definitely not Christian.
  - baud147258 5y ago
    I hope not, because I'd prefer if we don't give even more power to a bunch of unelected technocrats in Brussels.
    - johnnycerberus 5y ago
      They are elected. In Romania we have voted for the people that represent us in the European Parliament. Voted for an independent fella.
taurath 5y ago
Don’t underestimate energy companies ability to bring in a ton of state firepower to keep their bottom line intact - that’s one of the main lessons of the 20th century.
mod50ack 5y ago
Little-known fact, this actually occurred before: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War
refurb 5y ago
I mean the US had a civil war over the “rules”, so it’s kind of clear what it would do.
bogomipz 5y ago
You might want to look up the American Civil War. It lasted from 1861 to 1865 and some 600K people died. That's what happened the last time any states threatened to secede from the Union in the US of A. It's also a pretty well-known bit of history.
- fallingknife 5y ago
  The war started well after states started seceding and even then only in response to a military attack by the south. So it's not quite the example you portray it to be.
  - bogomipz 5y ago
    The secession convention meeting in Charleston, South Carolina occurs on December 20, 1860. Confederate troops fired on Fort Sumter on April 12, 1861. Let's see that's 3.5 months later. And for 3 of those 3.5 months the US has a lame-duck President in James Buchanan whose cabinet was also famously split oh the issue. Lincoln isn't inaugurated until March 4, 1861. Further, the attack on Fort Sumter is just the "official" start of the war. It's not like nothing was being done by the Union in the interim. Far from it. As early as January 5th of 1861 hundreds of troops and provisions were sent to fortify the Sumter garrison. Lastly on April 4th Lincoln tells his southern delegates that he intends to attempt to resupply Fort Sumter. This is understood by the Southern states to be a declaration of war. So yes I think this is exactly the example I portray it to be.
- rsynnott 5y ago
  That was about secession, though, not misbehavior. In fact, arguably it proves the point; after the US civil war there was a period of 'reconstruction', which largely failed, and then the southern states carried on doing pretty much whatever they felt like for the next century. EDIT: As mentioned below, desire to misbehave was certainly at the root of the secession, but in practice even after the war was won the federal government wasn't able to impose its will particularly effectively.
  - bogomipz 5y ago

EU is as helpless as USA. what would US of A do with a rogue Texas? nothing

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

nix23 5y ago

The EU is not a state...thank god for that, and that it never happens.

johnnycerberus 5y ago
But it can be a federation of states. Hopefully, that will happen.
- nix23 5y ago
  Depends how much the states have their own freedom and power (financial marketplace, and military), remember Russia is a federation too.
- bluthund 5y ago
  Hopefully that never happens. Hopefully more Hungary's emerge. Hopefully more Western countries start actually serving their people Hopefully nationalism crushes this perverse anti Western virus which has taken over the once greatest nations in the world
  - egeozcan 5y ago
    In this day and age, don't people like you read/watch some world history? What you are saying seems so narrow-minded (ignoring the racist undertone), it makes me confused.
    - bluthund 5y ago
      It's precisely a studying and understanding of history which makes me so. Perhaps people like you would do better to engage in conversation where you might learn something you don't know rather than throw out your classic epithets
      - egeozcan 5y ago
        So, to be clear, you studied and "understood" history and came to the conclusion that nationalism is a good thing. How? It's clear that I don't agree with you. I think you must be too isolated from some nice people to be so furious about other people.
        bluthund 5y ago
        We can circle back to the psycho analysis later if you so desire, but I'll be sticking to the topic at hand for the time being. You seem to have made a connection between nationalism and being furious about other people. I respectfully disagree that there is a necessary relationship there. I have no ill will against other people. I would like people who share my culture to govern me, and I would not like people of my culture governing people of a different culture. They can govern themselves and we can govern ourselves. We can share ideas, trade, sport, etc., But multiculturalism within borders is an inevitable failure and globalism is an inevitable failure
        egeozcan 5y ago
        > I would like people who share my culture to govern me, and I would not like people of my culture governing people of a different culture. When did this ever happen in history? People diverge all the time, that's how we have so many cultures.
        nix23 5y ago
        >People diverge all the time, that's how we have so many cultures. Lightly categorized in so called country's?
        5y ago
  - johnnycerberus 5y ago
    I'm certain that every Romanian sees Vitkor Orban as a wolf in sheep's clothing. The protector of interests for V4 group through unethical means and corrupted politicians. Hopefully, sanctions will follow soon. Masking local interests of a few corrupted individuals with nationalism is borderline criminal.
  - nix23 5y ago
    >Hopefully nationalism crushes this perverse anti Western virus Being totally against the EU, i think full on nationalism is wrong too. We life on one big spaceship and with that, we should have one organizing (not governing entity) like the UN was once meant to be.
    - johnnycerberus 5y ago
      EU is built on the European thought at least, it is the child of Christianity, strongly influenced by Greco-Roman world sprinkled with some Germanic austerity. No wonder why countries with Muslim minorities cannot join the Union. UN would never work because what binds Europe together is exactly this shared Christian past starting from the division of Catholic and Orthodox Church and ending with Protestant thought. Even if our European elite act as religion does not play a role anymore that is simply not true. Christianity is the most enduring and influential legacy of the ancient world, and its emergence the single most transformative development in Western history. Even the increasing number in the West today who have abandoned the faith of their forebears, and dismiss all religion as pointless superstition, remain recognisably its heirs. From Western France to Eastern Romania, the legacy can be felt in everything, from language to cuisine, from architecture to music. Imagine that those countries are on opposite sides of the EU but they both speak a Romance language.
      - nix23 5y ago
        >No wonder why countries with Muslim minorities cannot join the Union. Germany has a Muslim minority. And Cyprus has 25%. I don't think Religion is a point here at all, culture definitely is.
      - trasz 5y ago
        You do realize that Islam is essentially a Christianity’s sequel, right? Also, your mistaking Christianity - which is doing just fine in the western world, probably better than ever - with its degenerate form of fundamentalist groups, based mostly on hate, eg homophobia. This is most visible in Poland - which is very Catholic, and definitely not Christian.
- baud147258 5y ago
  I hope not, because I'd prefer if we don't give even more power to a bunch of unelected technocrats in Brussels.
  - johnnycerberus 5y ago
    They are elected. In Romania we have voted for the people that represent us in the European Parliament. Voted for an independent fella.

taurath 5y ago

Don’t underestimate energy companies ability to bring in a ton of state firepower to keep their bottom line intact - that’s one of the main lessons of the 20th century.

mod50ack 5y ago

Little-known fact, this actually occurred before: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Civil_War

refurb 5y ago

I mean the US had a civil war over the “rules”, so it’s kind of clear what it would do.

bogomipz 5y ago

You might want to look up the American Civil War. It lasted from 1861 to 1865 and some 600K people died. That's what happened the last time any states threatened to secede from the Union in the US of A. It's also a pretty well-known bit of history.

fallingknife 5y ago
The war started well after states started seceding and even then only in response to a military attack by the south. So it's not quite the example you portray it to be.
- bogomipz 5y ago
  The secession convention meeting in Charleston, South Carolina occurs on December 20, 1860. Confederate troops fired on Fort Sumter on April 12, 1861. Let's see that's 3.5 months later. And for 3 of those 3.5 months the US has a lame-duck President in James Buchanan whose cabinet was also famously split oh the issue. Lincoln isn't inaugurated until March 4, 1861. Further, the attack on Fort Sumter is just the "official" start of the war. It's not like nothing was being done by the Union in the interim. Far from it. As early as January 5th of 1861 hundreds of troops and provisions were sent to fortify the Sumter garrison. Lastly on April 4th Lincoln tells his southern delegates that he intends to attempt to resupply Fort Sumter. This is understood by the Southern states to be a declaration of war. So yes I think this is exactly the example I portray it to be.
rsynnott 5y ago
That was about secession, though, not misbehavior. In fact, arguably it proves the point; after the US civil war there was a period of 'reconstruction', which largely failed, and then the southern states carried on doing pretty much whatever they felt like for the next century. EDIT: As mentioned below, desire to misbehave was certainly at the root of the secession, but in practice even after the war was won the federal government wasn't able to impose its will particularly effectively.
- bogomipz 5y ago