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I think I sit in the middle on this. I don't think it is evil but if you dig under the surface a little you will find a lot of trauma, anxiety and desperation w

I think I sit in the middle on this. I don't think it is evil but if you dig under the surface a little you will find a lot of trauma, anxiety and desperation whether it is narcissistic instagram posts or OF style porn.

girvo 5y ago
I think you're correct, but I also think that's a property of the human condition and underlies nearly everything humans do for attention (to some extent or another, obviously to a much lesser extent the broader we're talking). Trauma, anxiety and desperation are so common that I'm not sure what isn't impacted by them, I guess is my meaning.
- sebmellen 5y ago
  I don’t know… I think people are cynical these days in large part because the world around us is dominated by this status angst. But it wasn’t always this way. Not even close. I’ve met many people who grew up in pre- and post-WWII Germany, and from how they describe it, the concept of status didn’t really exist then as it does now. Yes, there were rich and poor. But people fell in love with and married people in their towns and villages, and were not unhappy in doing so. With the exception of the war (a significant exemption, true) people’s lives seemed clear-cut, and no one felt the need to constantly be posting or drip-feeding off of likes or views or even money. These apps and platforms are recent inventions, and they are dangerous. Status is no longer a local or regional commodity, it is global. And your status is constantly being evaluated against every metric. Instead of being satisfied with being the best wine-grower in the region, for example, one is now forced to also compare oneself to the best bodybuilders in the world and the richest businesspeople. Though at times overdramatized, ”The Social Dilemma” is a great documentary on this topic. I would also recommend Tristan Harris’s podcast episode with Joe Rogan.
  - nly 5y ago
    Technology has enabled us to feel "close" (or at least simulate closeness) with a larger number of people over greater distances. We just didn't evolve for these large abstract social groups and we're still adapting as a species to it. We're just like polar bears being confined in a zoo and pacing up and down.
  - watwut 5y ago
    Your description of pre-WWII Germany is overly idyllic. We would not had WWII if pre-WWII Germans were that happy. The Germany was pretty violent, unstable place with serious economical problems including homelessness. The whole phenomenon of young men fighting on the streets with political opponents had a lot to do with them being unhappy about their place and options in society. Some people and marriages were happy, but definitely not all of them were happy. The society was changing on all directions leading to conflicts. Young women in particular tended to move away from villages to cities for greater freedom and economic options, followed by backslash over proper female place.
    - sebmellen 5y ago
      Surely, that's why I added "with the exception of the war (a significant exemption, true)". I only describe Germany in this way because it's the country where I have the deepest roots and speak the language. I am sure this sentiment would mirror across most of Europe, absent the many horrors and tragedies of the 20th century. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying I'd like to go back and live in the 20th century, but I do think some ways of life in those times were simpler and better acclimated to human nature.
      - watwut 5y ago
        I was not talking about war. I was talking about period between wars. From after WWI till dictatorship, Germany was violent place with regular street fights and tons on social problems. After Hitler took power, it continued to be violent place, tho in somewhat different way.
elevenoh 5y ago
Yeah, I also think this is an expression of a natural human feeling that'd exist whether the technology is there or not.
- rorykoehler 5y ago
  Beer and whiskey both have alcohol in them but try drinking 1 litre of whiskey every day and see where you end up.

girvo 5y ago

I think you're correct, but I also think that's a property of the human condition and underlies nearly everything humans do for attention (to some extent or another, obviously to a much lesser extent the broader we're talking). Trauma, anxiety and desperation are so common that I'm not sure what isn't impacted by them, I guess is my meaning.

sebmellen 5y ago
I don’t know… I think people are cynical these days in large part because the world around us is dominated by this status angst. But it wasn’t always this way. Not even close. I’ve met many people who grew up in pre- and post-WWII Germany, and from how they describe it, the concept of status didn’t really exist then as it does now. Yes, there were rich and poor. But people fell in love with and married people in their towns and villages, and were not unhappy in doing so. With the exception of the war (a significant exemption, true) people’s lives seemed clear-cut, and no one felt the need to constantly be posting or drip-feeding off of likes or views or even money. These apps and platforms are recent inventions, and they are dangerous. Status is no longer a local or regional commodity, it is global. And your status is constantly being evaluated against every metric. Instead of being satisfied with being the best wine-grower in the region, for example, one is now forced to also compare oneself to the best bodybuilders in the world and the richest businesspeople. Though at times overdramatized, ”The Social Dilemma” is a great documentary on this topic. I would also recommend Tristan Harris’s podcast episode with Joe Rogan.
- nly 5y ago
  Technology has enabled us to feel "close" (or at least simulate closeness) with a larger number of people over greater distances. We just didn't evolve for these large abstract social groups and we're still adapting as a species to it. We're just like polar bears being confined in a zoo and pacing up and down.
- watwut 5y ago
  Your description of pre-WWII Germany is overly idyllic. We would not had WWII if pre-WWII Germans were that happy. The Germany was pretty violent, unstable place with serious economical problems including homelessness. The whole phenomenon of young men fighting on the streets with political opponents had a lot to do with them being unhappy about their place and options in society. Some people and marriages were happy, but definitely not all of them were happy. The society was changing on all directions leading to conflicts. Young women in particular tended to move away from villages to cities for greater freedom and economic options, followed by backslash over proper female place.
  - sebmellen 5y ago
    Surely, that's why I added "with the exception of the war (a significant exemption, true)". I only describe Germany in this way because it's the country where I have the deepest roots and speak the language. I am sure this sentiment would mirror across most of Europe, absent the many horrors and tragedies of the 20th century. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying I'd like to go back and live in the 20th century, but I do think some ways of life in those times were simpler and better acclimated to human nature.
    - watwut 5y ago
      I was not talking about war. I was talking about period between wars. From after WWI till dictatorship, Germany was violent place with regular street fights and tons on social problems. After Hitler took power, it continued to be violent place, tho in somewhat different way.

elevenoh 5y ago

Yeah, I also think this is an expression of a natural human feeling that'd exist whether the technology is there or not.

rorykoehler 5y ago
Beer and whiskey both have alcohol in them but try drinking 1 litre of whiskey every day and see where you end up.