10 ms·

Did you contact Arbeiterkammer, VKI or Peter Kolba?

injidup 5y ago
I contacted and spoke at length with the Austrian Kosumantenschutz. https://www.arbeiterkammer.at/beratung/konsumentenschutz/index.html https://www.arbeiterkammer.at/beratung/konsumentenschutz/ind... The product is clearly and at minimum a case of false advertising as there is nothing approaching a computer chip inside. However and though sympathetic the KS/AK said they couldn't do anything and couldn't refer me to anybody who could. I found this rather surprising.
- OriginalNebula 5y ago
  Try to contact the other two. You can reach Peter Kolba here https://www.verbraucherschutzverein.at/Kontakt/ https://www.verbraucherschutzverein.at/Kontakt/ or on Twitter even https://twitter.com/KolbaPeter https://twitter.com/KolbaPeter. He won the case against Volkswagen so if anyone can help you then him. The University of Salzburg also has a "Ethikkommission" https://www.plus.ac.at/service/uni-administration/gesamtuniversitaere-gremien/ethikkommission/ https://www.plus.ac.at/service/uni-administration/gesamtuniv... and "Kommission zur Sicherung guter wissenschaftlicher Praxis" https://www.plus.ac.at/service/uni-administration/gesamtuniversitaere-gremien/kommission-neu/ https://www.plus.ac.at/service/uni-administration/gesamtuniv...
  - injidup 5y ago
    Thankyou for the tip. I'Ll look into it tomorrow.
    - OriginalNebula 5y ago
      No, thank you! Austria has a weird thing with pseudoscience scams [0][1][2] and it needs to be dealt with. [0] https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belebtes_Wasser https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belebtes_Wasser [1] The current Minister of Economy was working as an "energizer" https://www.diepresse.com/5395317/wirtschaftsministerin-schrambock-war-energetikerin https://www.diepresse.com/5395317/wirtschaftsministerin-schr... [2] During the construction of a hospital in Vienna, an "energetic" ring was built around the construction site for 95000 Euro. https://www.derstandard.at/story/2000076199184/krankenhaus-wien-nord-95-000-euro-fuer-energetischen-schutzring https://www.derstandard.at/story/2000076199184/krankenhaus-w... among others
      - biztos 5y ago
        Wow, that water looks amazing! Is anybody using it to brew bulletproof coffee[0]? [0]: https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/14/style/the-cult-of-the-bulletproof-coffee-diet.html https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/14/style/the-cult-of-the-bul...
      - injidup 5y ago
        @OriginalNebula There is also this https://www.air-innovation.fr/en/produit/vague-de-bien-etre-geowave/ https://www.air-innovation.fr/en/produit/vague-de-bien-etre-... and were installed into hospitals in austria at great cost https://www.salzburg24.at/news/salzburg/wo-in-salzburg-noch-geowaves-installiert-wurden-58062319 https://www.salzburg24.at/news/salzburg/wo-in-salzburg-noch-... Unsurprisingly the owner of powerinsole a Mr Martin Masching is also involved in this enterprise via https://geowave-shop.at/epages/c0f45b90-03b3-4b2d-8e1d-55912ea0a750.sf/en_US/?ObjectPath=/Shops/c0f45b90-03b3-4b2d-8e1d-55912ea0a750/Categories/Seite__Kategorie1 https://geowave-shop.at/epages/c0f45b90-03b3-4b2d-8e1d-55912...
        OriginalNebula 5y ago
        I think its time you contact some investigative journalists with this Powerinsole/Geowave connection. https://twitter.com/florianklenk https://twitter.com/florianklenk klenk@falter.at https://twitter.com/ThomasWalach https://twitter.com/ThomasWalach redaktion@zackzack.at https://twitter.com/mnikbakhsh https://twitter.com/mnikbakhsh nikbakhsh.michael@profil.at https://twitter.com/ukschmid https://twitter.com/ukschmid
      - read_if_gay_ 5y ago
        Meanwhile I'm trying to launch a simple health related mobile app and it's an absolutely insurmountable amount of paperwork for a solo dev.
        jahnu 5y ago
        One "hack" to get around that is to change your health app into a "beauty" or "cosmetic" or "wellness" app. It's a very different set of regulations.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
  - injidup 5y ago
    tweet sent https://twitter.com/sltyhkr/status/1417213194540625925 https://twitter.com/sltyhkr/status/1417213194540625925
    - exact_string 5y ago
      I don't understand what the problem is: The data in the double-blind study clearly shows no statistically significant effects (just look at N and the standard deviation bars) and the company doesn't claim that there would be such effects. The company only says there is a "positive trend" which there indeed is.
      - dingidong 5y ago
        Doesn't matter if the SD bars make it obvious. No layman can read such a chart. The text 110% makes it sound like the study PROVES without any doubt that the product had an effect. "the lactate measurement shows a difference" "The lower lactate value with Powerinsole means longer performance and a later onset of muscle fatigue." and finally "Even with the first application of the power insole, a lower skin conductance is evident compared to the placebo. This means that the power insole can help reduce stress levels." Nowhere are they talking about statistical significance.

I contacted and spoke at length with the Austrian Kosumantenschutz. https://www.arbeiterkammer.at/beratung/konsumentenschutz/index.html https://www.arbeiterkammer.at/beratung/konsumentenschutz/ind... The product is clearly and at minimum a case of false advertising as there is nothing approaching a computer chip inside. However and though sympathetic the KS/AK said they couldn't do anything and couldn't refer me to anybody who could. I found this rather surprising.

OriginalNebula 5y ago
Try to contact the other two. You can reach Peter Kolba here https://www.verbraucherschutzverein.at/Kontakt/ https://www.verbraucherschutzverein.at/Kontakt/ or on Twitter even https://twitter.com/KolbaPeter https://twitter.com/KolbaPeter. He won the case against Volkswagen so if anyone can help you then him. The University of Salzburg also has a "Ethikkommission" https://www.plus.ac.at/service/uni-administration/gesamtuniversitaere-gremien/ethikkommission/ https://www.plus.ac.at/service/uni-administration/gesamtuniv... and "Kommission zur Sicherung guter wissenschaftlicher Praxis" https://www.plus.ac.at/service/uni-administration/gesamtuniversitaere-gremien/kommission-neu/ https://www.plus.ac.at/service/uni-administration/gesamtuniv...
- injidup 5y ago
  Thankyou for the tip. I'Ll look into it tomorrow.
  - OriginalNebula 5y ago
    No, thank you! Austria has a weird thing with pseudoscience scams [0][1][2] and it needs to be dealt with. [0] https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belebtes_Wasser https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belebtes_Wasser [1] The current Minister of Economy was working as an "energizer" https://www.diepresse.com/5395317/wirtschaftsministerin-schrambock-war-energetikerin https://www.diepresse.com/5395317/wirtschaftsministerin-schr... [2] During the construction of a hospital in Vienna, an "energetic" ring was built around the construction site for 95000 Euro. https://www.derstandard.at/story/2000076199184/krankenhaus-wien-nord-95-000-euro-fuer-energetischen-schutzring https://www.derstandard.at/story/2000076199184/krankenhaus-w... among others
    - biztos 5y ago
      Wow, that water looks amazing! Is anybody using it to brew bulletproof coffee[0]? [0]: https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/14/style/the-cult-of-the-bulletproof-coffee-diet.html https://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/14/style/the-cult-of-the-bul...
    - injidup 5y ago
      @OriginalNebula There is also this https://www.air-innovation.fr/en/produit/vague-de-bien-etre-geowave/ https://www.air-innovation.fr/en/produit/vague-de-bien-etre-... and were installed into hospitals in austria at great cost https://www.salzburg24.at/news/salzburg/wo-in-salzburg-noch-geowaves-installiert-wurden-58062319 https://www.salzburg24.at/news/salzburg/wo-in-salzburg-noch-... Unsurprisingly the owner of powerinsole a Mr Martin Masching is also involved in this enterprise via https://geowave-shop.at/epages/c0f45b90-03b3-4b2d-8e1d-55912ea0a750.sf/en_US/?ObjectPath=/Shops/c0f45b90-03b3-4b2d-8e1d-55912ea0a750/Categories/Seite__Kategorie1 https://geowave-shop.at/epages/c0f45b90-03b3-4b2d-8e1d-55912...
      - OriginalNebula 5y ago
        I think its time you contact some investigative journalists with this Powerinsole/Geowave connection. https://twitter.com/florianklenk https://twitter.com/florianklenk klenk@falter.at https://twitter.com/ThomasWalach https://twitter.com/ThomasWalach redaktion@zackzack.at https://twitter.com/mnikbakhsh https://twitter.com/mnikbakhsh nikbakhsh.michael@profil.at https://twitter.com/ukschmid https://twitter.com/ukschmid
    - read_if_gay_ 5y ago
      Meanwhile I'm trying to launch a simple health related mobile app and it's an absolutely insurmountable amount of paperwork for a solo dev.
      - jahnu 5y ago
        One "hack" to get around that is to change your health app into a "beauty" or "cosmetic" or "wellness" app. It's a very different set of regulations.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- injidup 5y ago
  tweet sent https://twitter.com/sltyhkr/status/1417213194540625925 https://twitter.com/sltyhkr/status/1417213194540625925
  - exact_string 5y ago
    I don't understand what the problem is: The data in the double-blind study clearly shows no statistically significant effects (just look at N and the standard deviation bars) and the company doesn't claim that there would be such effects. The company only says there is a "positive trend" which there indeed is.
    - dingidong 5y ago
      Doesn't matter if the SD bars make it obvious. No layman can read such a chart. The text 110% makes it sound like the study PROVES without any doubt that the product had an effect. "the lactate measurement shows a difference" "The lower lactate value with Powerinsole means longer performance and a later onset of muscle fatigue." and finally "Even with the first application of the power insole, a lower skin conductance is evident compared to the placebo. This means that the power insole can help reduce stress levels." Nowhere are they talking about statistical significance.