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>Telegram doesn’t make money, or at least it doesn’t generate revenues, as of 2019. Durov pointed out on a blog post that he “believes in fast and secure messag

by maqp 5y ago

>Telegram doesn’t make money, or at least it doesn’t generate revenues, as of 2019. Durov pointed out on a blog post that he “believes in fast and secure messaging that is also 100% free.” Durov might as well be paying lip service here. Telegram reserves the right to change its ToS. Facebook didn't spy on 100% of its users actions when it started. It was a picture rating service. The business model came after. Durov still has money left after he was forced out of VKontatke. He's in no rush to cash in. There's no telling when Telegram will be sold: it's not a non-profit and can be sold any moment. I can understand philanthropy, but given how Durov has paid zero dollars over the past 8 years to cryptographers to design a protocol that ACTUALLY locks him out of terabytes of insanely valuable user data, I find it hard to believe his motives are pure. With Moxie and Signal I can trivially say it's not a CIA front despite any money from Radio Free Asia, because I can check the end-to-end encryption works and protects every message. Given Durov's background in information warfare and disinformation, connections to Russia etc. and him having access to almost 100% of users' content and metadata, I can't say with confidence Telegram isn't an SVR (Russian NSA) front.

Dah00n 5y ago
>I can check the end-to-end encryption works and protects every message. You would be a fool and a poor spook if you created Signal as a honeypot and made it insecure from the get go to anyone looking. It would be made insecure either later on or by an extremely hard to find "bug". We know from Snowden that the NSA secretly weakens encryption products to make them vulnerable. All your case proves(?) is that Signal is a better made honeypot than Telegram if any of them are actually a trap.
- maqp 5y ago
  "You would be a fool and a poor spook if you created Signal as a honeypot and made it insecure from the get go to anyone looking. It would be made insecure either later on or by an extremely hard to find "bug". We know from Snowden that the NSA secretly weakens encryption products to make them vulnerable. All your case proves(?) is that Signal is a better made honeypot than Telegram if any of them are actually a trap. " You can't be serious. Anyone can show that vulnerability in the codebase. Signal has internal code review processes, and the git log is public. There is no better process out there, or if there is, you'll have to explain it. There is no perfect process but if you're trying to argue that justifies Telegram doing nothing wrt e.g. group chat end-to-end encryption, you're out of your mind. Here's the thing: There's nothing that indicates Signal has a backdoor. OTOH, Telegram doesn't have to be converted into one, it ALREADY DOES IT. All that the NSAs of the world have to do, is hack the server. And since you're so intimately aware of Snowden's output, might I remind you of his SXSW talk from 2014 where he said NSA hacks systems all the time?

by maqp 5y ago

Dah00n 5y ago

>I can check the end-to-end encryption works and protects every message. You would be a fool and a poor spook if you created Signal as a honeypot and made it insecure from the get go to anyone looking. It would be made insecure either later on or by an extremely hard to find "bug". We know from Snowden that the NSA secretly weakens encryption products to make them vulnerable. All your case proves(?) is that Signal is a better made honeypot than Telegram if any of them are actually a trap.

maqp 5y ago
"You would be a fool and a poor spook if you created Signal as a honeypot and made it insecure from the get go to anyone looking. It would be made insecure either later on or by an extremely hard to find "bug". We know from Snowden that the NSA secretly weakens encryption products to make them vulnerable. All your case proves(?) is that Signal is a better made honeypot than Telegram if any of them are actually a trap. " You can't be serious. Anyone can show that vulnerability in the codebase. Signal has internal code review processes, and the git log is public. There is no better process out there, or if there is, you'll have to explain it. There is no perfect process but if you're trying to argue that justifies Telegram doing nothing wrt e.g. group chat end-to-end encryption, you're out of your mind. Here's the thing: There's nothing that indicates Signal has a backdoor. OTOH, Telegram doesn't have to be converted into one, it ALREADY DOES IT. All that the NSAs of the world have to do, is hack the server. And since you're so intimately aware of Snowden's output, might I remind you of his SXSW talk from 2014 where he said NSA hacks systems all the time?