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Same applies to obesity in your opinion? The risks are very well known but people don’t do enough to prevent it and take care of themselves. Should obese peop

Same applies to obesity in your opinion? The risks are very well known but people don’t do enough to prevent it and take care of themselves. Should obese people not relieve medical care due to their negligence and unwillingness to eat less?

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
JumpCrisscross 5y ago
> Same applies to obesity in your opinion? Of course not. We don’t understand how to prevent obesity. And losing weight—or keeping it off—involves more than visiting a Walgreens. Also, if you’re obese, you’re suffering the effects of obesity all the time. If you’re unvaccinated, you are fine 99% of the time. If you stay home as much as possible, wear a mask outdoors and avoid large gatherings, you’re likely to continue being fine.
- BJBBB 5y ago
  "We don't understand how to prevent obesity." Please reference below: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25196414/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25196414/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3606061/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3606061/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/obesity-prevention-source/obesity-prevention/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/obesity-prevention-source/obesi... https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/obesity/preventing-obesity https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseas... https://effectivehealthcare.ahrq.gov/products/obesity-research-methods/research-protocol https://effectivehealthcare.ahrq.gov/products/obesity-resear...
  - JumpCrisscross 5y ago
    Read your first link. Literally, from the abstract: “The evidence base is limited in quantity and quality and insufficient to provide clear guidance“ [1]. The entire paper is about the “major evidence gaps.” [1] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25196414/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25196414/
    - BJBBB 5y ago
      Which is why I included it first and did not bury it and did not ignore it on my search. But I will give you brownie and taco points for actually reading the references I have read many scientific, peer-reviewed papers on this subject. There is too much 'insufficient' data and too much correlation/causation issues. I am a hardware engineer, so am driven, delimited, and succeed or fail on the veracity of my data. I can generally depend on good data provided by suppliers and its efficacy because it is based on Physics. I have read may MS and PhD papers in botany and cellular biology, and a few CDC/NIH/FDA papers on the OT. I will conjecture that there are too many life scientists on these research teams and not enough physical scientists and engineers.
- NikolaeVarius 5y ago
  Losing weight == eating less. Not rocket science
  - postoak 5y ago
    Humans evolved to allow hunger to override the rational thinking part of the brain. The older parts of the brain can basically shut off the newer (logical thinking) parts. So even if you know you have to eat less to lose weight, often if food is available you won't be able to resist it if you are really hungry. Your statement is wrong, it is more complicated than that because we are hardwired to not starve if food is available.
  - inglor_cz 5y ago
    And yet no country in the world, rich or poor, Western or non-Western, managed to reduce its obesity levels to, say, three quarters of the maximal value or less. So it seems to be, in practice, a more complicated problem than reduction of smoking, which has been rather successful in many countries.
seized 5y ago
While obesity is a problem and the solutions heavily involve the person changing their life, it is not comparable to vaccines. Fixing obesity involves education (not everyone knows why McDonalds is junk, or that too much of anything can be bad, meaning portion control), skills training/learning (cooking healthy food can be a big leap for someone who only microwaves a frozen meal), local environment (there are places with poor selection of fresh vegetables), lifestyle stuff beyond food (stress from working two jobs leads to eating badly, drinking, etc), and socioeconomic changes (not everyone can afford all of the above easily). That doesn't even involve things like getting you kids on board, fitness, etc. And with all of that in place, significant weight loss is a long term effort spamming years for some people. Getting a vaccine involves rolling up a sleeve then sitting for a bit in case of reactions. And maybe making an appointment. Equating the two grossly overstates how hard it can be to deal with obesity vs getting a shot.
jasonlaramburu 5y ago
Obese people cannot infect others.
- inglor_cz 5y ago
  To a degree, yes. Not literally, because obesity isn't caused by a bug. But kids born and raised by fat parents have a high probability of ending up fat too. In this case, obesity is transmitted to other people through internalization of bad eating habits.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

JumpCrisscross 5y ago

> Same applies to obesity in your opinion? Of course not. We don’t understand how to prevent obesity. And losing weight—or keeping it off—involves more than visiting a Walgreens. Also, if you’re obese, you’re suffering the effects of obesity all the time. If you’re unvaccinated, you are fine 99% of the time. If you stay home as much as possible, wear a mask outdoors and avoid large gatherings, you’re likely to continue being fine.

BJBBB 5y ago
"We don't understand how to prevent obesity." Please reference below: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25196414/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25196414/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3606061/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3606061/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/obesity-prevention-source/obesity-prevention/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/obesity-prevention-source/obesi... https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/obesity/preventing-obesity https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseas... https://effectivehealthcare.ahrq.gov/products/obesity-research-methods/research-protocol https://effectivehealthcare.ahrq.gov/products/obesity-resear...
- JumpCrisscross 5y ago
  Read your first link. Literally, from the abstract: “The evidence base is limited in quantity and quality and insufficient to provide clear guidance“ [1]. The entire paper is about the “major evidence gaps.” [1] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25196414/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25196414/
  - BJBBB 5y ago
    Which is why I included it first and did not bury it and did not ignore it on my search. But I will give you brownie and taco points for actually reading the references I have read many scientific, peer-reviewed papers on this subject. There is too much 'insufficient' data and too much correlation/causation issues. I am a hardware engineer, so am driven, delimited, and succeed or fail on the veracity of my data. I can generally depend on good data provided by suppliers and its efficacy because it is based on Physics. I have read may MS and PhD papers in botany and cellular biology, and a few CDC/NIH/FDA papers on the OT. I will conjecture that there are too many life scientists on these research teams and not enough physical scientists and engineers.
NikolaeVarius 5y ago
Losing weight == eating less. Not rocket science
- postoak 5y ago
  Humans evolved to allow hunger to override the rational thinking part of the brain. The older parts of the brain can basically shut off the newer (logical thinking) parts. So even if you know you have to eat less to lose weight, often if food is available you won't be able to resist it if you are really hungry. Your statement is wrong, it is more complicated than that because we are hardwired to not starve if food is available.
- inglor_cz 5y ago
  And yet no country in the world, rich or poor, Western or non-Western, managed to reduce its obesity levels to, say, three quarters of the maximal value or less. So it seems to be, in practice, a more complicated problem than reduction of smoking, which has been rather successful in many countries.

seized 5y ago

While obesity is a problem and the solutions heavily involve the person changing their life, it is not comparable to vaccines. Fixing obesity involves education (not everyone knows why McDonalds is junk, or that too much of anything can be bad, meaning portion control), skills training/learning (cooking healthy food can be a big leap for someone who only microwaves a frozen meal), local environment (there are places with poor selection of fresh vegetables), lifestyle stuff beyond food (stress from working two jobs leads to eating badly, drinking, etc), and socioeconomic changes (not everyone can afford all of the above easily). That doesn't even involve things like getting you kids on board, fitness, etc. And with all of that in place, significant weight loss is a long term effort spamming years for some people. Getting a vaccine involves rolling up a sleeve then sitting for a bit in case of reactions. And maybe making an appointment. Equating the two grossly overstates how hard it can be to deal with obesity vs getting a shot.

jasonlaramburu 5y ago

Obese people cannot infect others.

inglor_cz 5y ago
To a degree, yes. Not literally, because obesity isn't caused by a bug. But kids born and raised by fat parents have a high probability of ending up fat too. In this case, obesity is transmitted to other people through internalization of bad eating habits.