6 ms·

Hello https://www.theguardian.com/science/2021/jul/16/huge-study-supporting-ivermectin-as-covid-treatment-withdrawn-over-ethical-concerns https://www.theguardi

Hello https://www.theguardian.com/science/2021/jul/16/huge-study-supporting-ivermectin-as-covid-treatment-withdrawn-over-ethical-concerns https://www.theguardian.com/science/2021/jul/16/huge-study-s...

swader999 5y ago
That study was apparently submitted by a blogger posing as a medical student. There's 62 and counting other studies out there. I linked to some of them above.
- walterbell 5y ago
  When this is all over, I look forward to forensic investigations of fraudulent medical publications which had the effect of advancing or slowing specific political viewpoints. E.g. one strawman submarine story can be used to drown dozens of legitimate stories. Or one flawed negative study requires 100+ doctors to object before the claims are withdrawn. We need to learn from these unfortunate incidents and improve our systemic defenses. Fortunately, digital trails provide much data that can be used to build better defenses.
- tptacek 5y ago
  The problem with that study is that it's widely cited and powerful; it is apparently responsible for the majority of all attributed positive effect for ivermectin in meta-analyses. The fact that it's author was fraudulent doesn't mitigate that!
  - swader999 5y ago
    The link I provided discussed that study and its impact and claimed that it certainly doesn't reverse any meta studies.
    - tptacek 5y ago
      I'm not sure we're talking about the same thing. Any meta-study that included the data from that paper has obviously been corrupted by it. And it was widely used in those studies.
      - tptacek 5y ago
        Just by way of example, the FLCCC's comprehensive review article, which you cited favorably above, includes dozens of citations to the now-withdrawn Algazzar study.
        srtjstjsj 5y ago
        Do "citations" affect the data? Citations are just for anti-plagiarism and for clout building, not science.
        gandalfgreybeer 5y ago
        If they are studies that are performing meta-analyses (and most of the studies citing the fraudulent article are), yes.
      - srtjstjsj 5y ago
        Do meta analyses not control for the influence of outlier studies? Could I just make up a phony result with 100000000x alleged effect and drown out all other studies in every meta analysis?
        tptacek 5y ago
        See the link at the top of the thread. That's more or less what happened here.

swader999 5y ago

That study was apparently submitted by a blogger posing as a medical student. There's 62 and counting other studies out there. I linked to some of them above.

walterbell 5y ago
When this is all over, I look forward to forensic investigations of fraudulent medical publications which had the effect of advancing or slowing specific political viewpoints. E.g. one strawman submarine story can be used to drown dozens of legitimate stories. Or one flawed negative study requires 100+ doctors to object before the claims are withdrawn. We need to learn from these unfortunate incidents and improve our systemic defenses. Fortunately, digital trails provide much data that can be used to build better defenses.
tptacek 5y ago
The problem with that study is that it's widely cited and powerful; it is apparently responsible for the majority of all attributed positive effect for ivermectin in meta-analyses. The fact that it's author was fraudulent doesn't mitigate that!
- swader999 5y ago
  The link I provided discussed that study and its impact and claimed that it certainly doesn't reverse any meta studies.
  - tptacek 5y ago
    I'm not sure we're talking about the same thing. Any meta-study that included the data from that paper has obviously been corrupted by it. And it was widely used in those studies.
    - tptacek 5y ago
      Just by way of example, the FLCCC's comprehensive review article, which you cited favorably above, includes dozens of citations to the now-withdrawn Algazzar study.
      - srtjstjsj 5y ago
        Do "citations" affect the data? Citations are just for anti-plagiarism and for clout building, not science.
        gandalfgreybeer 5y ago
        If they are studies that are performing meta-analyses (and most of the studies citing the fraudulent article are), yes.
    - srtjstjsj 5y ago
      Do meta analyses not control for the influence of outlier studies? Could I just make up a phony result with 100000000x alleged effect and drown out all other studies in every meta analysis?
      - tptacek 5y ago
        See the link at the top of the thread. That's more or less what happened here.