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Interesting video, the guy talks about "hydro metallurgical processing batteries" but I wonder how much these processes (grind up in a vacuum, boil off/condense

Interesting video, the guy talks about "hydro metallurgical processing batteries" but I wonder how much these processes (grind up in a vacuum, boil off/condense electrolytes, separate out plastics/etc and ground into black mask, acid bath of black mask and separate out into NiSO4, CoSO4, Li2SO4, etc) cost compared to typical mining operations?

aurizon 5y ago
Hydrometallurgical processes are water based processes where you react the digested battery liquid with other liquids to get a react product that can be dealt with by filtering. It is a complex, often proprietary process, changing Ph etc, and while patented it still has a lot of black art. The source rock ores, pegmatitees, of Li are low grade with many other mineral species.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pegmatite https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pegmatite Like a bag of nuts and bolts
- cinquemb 5y ago
  > It is a complex, often proprietary process, changing Ph etc, and while patented it still has a lot of black art. Yeah that's what I figured, but doesn't really tell me about the costs vs mining (which will be hard to tell from the outside because of the above) :/
  - aurizon 5y ago
    There are thousands of pegmatite deposits, with a mixed bag of nuts (associated minerals), each one needs to ba assessed as to extractable grade, the size of the deposit, the location, the environment etc. You do not get a pure Li ore body - it burns in air = you get a deposit of 2-3% Li with a mixed..... So lithium carbonate is worth about $15 per kilogram of the hydrated carbonate. LiCO3.2H2O = how it is used industrially with further processing. This can be followed here. https://www.pwc.com/ca/en/industries/mining/publications/lithium.html https://www.pwc.com/ca/en/industries/mining/publications/lit... https://www.fastmarkets.com/commodities/industrial-minerals/lithium-price-spotlight https://www.fastmarkets.com/commodities/industrial-minerals/...
    - cinquemb 5y ago
      Thanks, the second link looks very helpful and gave me further ideas on how to try to work backwards to get an idea of the recycling processing costs: find spot prices of raw/intermediates that come from the process produced by companies with the black box recycling processes while trying to find those companies volume sold/processed over time (ideally they would process more when the underlying market is more expensive).
  - aurizon 5y ago
    The only way is to read the quarterly MD&A and F/S from the various mining companies. The management discussion and analysis will give greater details, and the Financial Statements show the cash flows. A listed companies must file them quarterly and there is an annual report - all of which are audited.

aurizon 5y ago

Hydrometallurgical processes are water based processes where you react the digested battery liquid with other liquids to get a react product that can be dealt with by filtering. It is a complex, often proprietary process, changing Ph etc, and while patented it still has a lot of black art. The source rock ores, pegmatitees, of Li are low grade with many other mineral species.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pegmatite https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pegmatite Like a bag of nuts and bolts

cinquemb 5y ago
> It is a complex, often proprietary process, changing Ph etc, and while patented it still has a lot of black art. Yeah that's what I figured, but doesn't really tell me about the costs vs mining (which will be hard to tell from the outside because of the above) :/
- aurizon 5y ago
  There are thousands of pegmatite deposits, with a mixed bag of nuts (associated minerals), each one needs to ba assessed as to extractable grade, the size of the deposit, the location, the environment etc. You do not get a pure Li ore body - it burns in air = you get a deposit of 2-3% Li with a mixed..... So lithium carbonate is worth about $15 per kilogram of the hydrated carbonate. LiCO3.2H2O = how it is used industrially with further processing. This can be followed here. https://www.pwc.com/ca/en/industries/mining/publications/lithium.html https://www.pwc.com/ca/en/industries/mining/publications/lit... https://www.fastmarkets.com/commodities/industrial-minerals/lithium-price-spotlight https://www.fastmarkets.com/commodities/industrial-minerals/...
  - cinquemb 5y ago
    Thanks, the second link looks very helpful and gave me further ideas on how to try to work backwards to get an idea of the recycling processing costs: find spot prices of raw/intermediates that come from the process produced by companies with the black box recycling processes while trying to find those companies volume sold/processed over time (ideally they would process more when the underlying market is more expensive).
- aurizon 5y ago
  The only way is to read the quarterly MD&A and F/S from the various mining companies. The management discussion and analysis will give greater details, and the Financial Statements show the cash flows. A listed companies must file them quarterly and there is an annual report - all of which are audited.