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Software engineering hasn’t had our Quebec Bridge collapse yet. It will take an enormous visible disaster that does more than cost a company a few tens of mill

Software engineering hasn’t had our Quebec Bridge collapse yet. It will take an enormous visible disaster that does more than cost a company a few tens of millions, or exposes a few hundred million social security numbers before we start holding companies and engineers liable for security flaws.

swiley 5y ago
We've flown planes into the ground, killed people with Xrays, rigged elections, shut down oil delivery to sections of the east cost of the US. If anything we have bridge collapses constantly and special news anchors that report on which routes you should take today as if it were just like any other traffic incident.
- cratermoon 5y ago
  Don't forget crashing the first Ariane 5 on its test flight[1], incorrect floating point math[2] and losing $440 million in 30 minutes[3]. 1 https://www.esa.int/Newsroom/Press_Releases/Ariane_501_-_Presentation_of_Inquiry_Board_report https://www.esa.int/Newsroom/Press_Releases/Ariane_501_-_Pre... 2 https://www.cs.earlham.edu/~dusko/cs63/fdiv.html https://www.cs.earlham.edu/~dusko/cs63/fdiv.html 3 https://www.henricodolfing.com/2019/06/project-failure-case-study-knight-capital.html https://www.henricodolfing.com/2019/06/project-failure-case-... The Error of Our Ways: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YaI6lhn78g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YaI6lhn78g
Goety 5y ago
Ah yes the equifax hack https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/07/business/equifax-cyberattack.html https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/07/business/equifax-cyberatt... OPM Hack https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Office_of_Personnel_Management_data_breach https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Office_of_Personnel_Management... The only way to create software engineering reform you envision is to force a paradigm shift. The only thing that could instigate it would be like skynet with many dead. Though, the unknown damage from OPM could be quite severe. There might be 'security standards' but neither the government nor private sector can guarantee anything to be safe. The civilization built on IT networks will need to be rewowrked.
- learc83 5y ago
  Did you not notice that I referenced the Equifax hack?
  - filoleg 5y ago
    How many were killed as a consequence of the Equifax hack? Don't get me wrong, that hack was absolutely massive and terrible, but I think you missed the point of what the parent comment was saying. Their point was that it must be something real and visceral, on a level that will make people think "something like this must never happen again at any cost". As far as I know, there weren't massive killings of people due to the equifax hack, so that isn't quite on the same level.
    - learc83 5y ago
      The parent edited their comment after I commented. It originally said >Did you not remember the Equifax hack? Of course I didn’t remember it. I explicitly mentioned it as something that didn’t qualify as an Quebec Bridge collapse level event. They editing to make it seem like they realized that I mentioned it all along. To your point >it must be something real and visceral. I agree that was exactly what I was saying when I started this thread.
johnwalkr 5y ago
Therac-25 is a must-read-about. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Therac-25 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Therac-25
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

swiley 5y ago

We've flown planes into the ground, killed people with Xrays, rigged elections, shut down oil delivery to sections of the east cost of the US. If anything we have bridge collapses constantly and special news anchors that report on which routes you should take today as if it were just like any other traffic incident.

cratermoon 5y ago
Don't forget crashing the first Ariane 5 on its test flight[1], incorrect floating point math[2] and losing $440 million in 30 minutes[3]. 1 https://www.esa.int/Newsroom/Press_Releases/Ariane_501_-_Presentation_of_Inquiry_Board_report https://www.esa.int/Newsroom/Press_Releases/Ariane_501_-_Pre... 2 https://www.cs.earlham.edu/~dusko/cs63/fdiv.html https://www.cs.earlham.edu/~dusko/cs63/fdiv.html 3 https://www.henricodolfing.com/2019/06/project-failure-case-study-knight-capital.html https://www.henricodolfing.com/2019/06/project-failure-case-... The Error of Our Ways: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YaI6lhn78g https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YaI6lhn78g

Goety 5y ago

Ah yes the equifax hack https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/07/business/equifax-cyberattack.html https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/07/business/equifax-cyberatt... OPM Hack https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Office_of_Personnel_Management_data_breach https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Office_of_Personnel_Management... The only way to create software engineering reform you envision is to force a paradigm shift. The only thing that could instigate it would be like skynet with many dead. Though, the unknown damage from OPM could be quite severe. There might be 'security standards' but neither the government nor private sector can guarantee anything to be safe. The civilization built on IT networks will need to be rewowrked.

learc83 5y ago
Did you not notice that I referenced the Equifax hack?
- filoleg 5y ago
  How many were killed as a consequence of the Equifax hack? Don't get me wrong, that hack was absolutely massive and terrible, but I think you missed the point of what the parent comment was saying. Their point was that it must be something real and visceral, on a level that will make people think "something like this must never happen again at any cost". As far as I know, there weren't massive killings of people due to the equifax hack, so that isn't quite on the same level.
  - learc83 5y ago
    The parent edited their comment after I commented. It originally said >Did you not remember the Equifax hack? Of course I didn’t remember it. I explicitly mentioned it as something that didn’t qualify as an Quebec Bridge collapse level event. They editing to make it seem like they realized that I mentioned it all along. To your point >it must be something real and visceral. I agree that was exactly what I was saying when I started this thread.

johnwalkr 5y ago

Therac-25 is a must-read-about. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Therac-25 https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Therac-25

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]