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> The point is that the Raspberry Pi -- any version -- has always been underpowered and overhyped. This sort of comment is extremely short-sighted and totally

by rualca 5y ago

> The point is that the Raspberry Pi -- any version -- has always been underpowered and overhyped. This sort of comment is extremely short-sighted and totally oblivious to . A raspberry pi was always, from the very first day, an inexpensive (even expendable) ubiquitous computing platform aimed at being the infrastructure for educational projects. Do you want to toy around with a robot? You spend 20 or 30€, a few actuators, perhaps a camera, slap in some python code, and you're good to go. Do you want to toy around with LEDs to make them blink? You spend 20 or 30€, add a few LEDs, slap some python code and you're good to go. Do you want to toy around with distributed systems? You spend 60 or 80€ on three or four RPIs, plug them into a router and you're good to go. Do you want to toy around with wifi mesh networks? You spend 60 or 80€ on three or four RPIs, configure them, and you're good to go. Do you want to toy around with a media center? You spend 20 or 30€ on a RPI, configure it, and you're good to go. What´s the common denominator? Enough pocket money to get your hands on a RPI, and you do not care that it gets blown up because you can get another one just as easily. Raspberri Pis flatten the learning curve to the point where kids in middleschool can go at it without any concern. It's just a computer running linux that does not have to deal with arcane devkits or resource constraints. Do you know what would cost to do the same thing prior to Raspberry Pi creating this whole sector? Between 300 and 500€ for a single devboard with similar spects.

flyinghamster 5y ago
Well said. Yes, the Raspberry Pi family has its foibles, but let's not let the perfect be the enemy of the good. (My main beef: the techbro "let's change your configuration behind your back" shenanigans with the Microsoft repository, but that's a software thing.) They've been upfront about their educational mission since day one, and it's just a bonus that it took off with hobbyists. On the other hand, the widespread hobbyist adoption is undoubtedly a big factor in its success. If nothing else, it gave ARM board makers a boot in the behind and got them to build boards that don't cost an arm and a leg. We wouldn't have sub-$100 Jetson Nanos if the Pi hadn't blazed a trail.
Sebb767 5y ago
> You spend 60 or 80€ on three or four RPIs, No. I agree with you that the RPI is a great experiment board, but usually you don't get them for below 30€ (20 for the zeros). Then you need an SD card (10€) and probably power supply. Add on a case and some electronics if you're fancy, then add 5€ shipping. I like the RPi, don't get me wrong. But something like a RPI cluster easily ends up in the 150-200€ range, even in it's most minimal form. The GP is right that, unless you're going specifically for having a cluster or GPIO, other options are simply more performance for your money.
- rualca 5y ago
  > No. I agree with you that the RPI is a great experiment board, but usually you don't get them for below 30€ (20 for the zeros). You should really look up those prices because your assertions don't match reality. I am, right now, looking at the page of a distributor listed in raspberry pi which sells raspberry pi 3+ for 28€ plus 4€ shipping. Amazon sells 16GB SD cards for 5€, and a charger is really the least of your budget problems. The same store sells Raspberry Pi Zero W for 11€ a pop, and Raspberry Pi Zeros for 5€. Hell, a while ago there were magazines giving away raspberry pi zeros with the mag.
  - Sebb767 5y ago
    I'd like to see that reseller. A german comparison site list 37+4 Euros for the 3B+ [0] and 39+4 for the 4 2GB [1]. Reichelt, an official reseller, list 37 Euros for the 3 [2]. Amazon lists 66 Euros for the 4 4GB [4]. [0] https://geizhals.de/raspberry-pi-3-modell-b-a1785657.html https://geizhals.de/raspberry-pi-3-modell-b-a1785657.html [1] https://geizhals.de/raspberry-pi-4-modell-b-a2081127.html https://geizhals.de/raspberry-pi-4-modell-b-a2081127.html [2] https://www.reichelt.de/de/de/raspberry-pi-3-b-4x-1-2-ghz-1-gb-ram-wlan-bt-raspberry-pi-3-p164977.html?search=raspberry+pi&&r=1 https://www.reichelt.de/de/de/raspberry-pi-3-b-4x-1-2-ghz-1-... [3] https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Raspberry-ARM-Cortex-A72-WLAN-ac-Bluetooth-Micro-HDMI-Single/dp/B07TC2BK1X/ https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Raspberry-ARM-Cortex-A72-WLAN-ac-... > Amazon sells 16GB SD cards for 5€, and a charger is really the least of your budget problems. A 5 port USB charger is 25 Euro: https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Anker-PowerPort-Port-Charger-Single/dp/B00VUGOSWY/ref=sr_1_3 https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Anker-PowerPort-Port-Charger-Sing... You can go a bit cheaper, but not too much in order to avoid brown-outs (very possible with the Pi 3/4, but 1A charger struggle even with the older models). You can save on the SD cards, if disk performance does not matter, I give you that. Still, these small amounts add up quickly. When we're talking about a sub-100 Euro project, throwing in 20 euro for the charger and another 20 for SD cards quickly drains your budget. Even with your pricing, a Pi 3+ cluster would run us (28+5)*[3/4]+4+20 = 123/156 Euros - close to double the original estimate and without any cables whatsoever. I don't mean to say the Pi is overly expensive - it's good value for what it is. But these small project do quickly add up and when you don't play it's strengths, you end up in a situation where you pay more money for the Pi project than more powerful hardware would have cost you in the beginning.

by rualca 5y ago

flyinghamster 5y ago

Well said. Yes, the Raspberry Pi family has its foibles, but let's not let the perfect be the enemy of the good. (My main beef: the techbro "let's change your configuration behind your back" shenanigans with the Microsoft repository, but that's a software thing.) They've been upfront about their educational mission since day one, and it's just a bonus that it took off with hobbyists. On the other hand, the widespread hobbyist adoption is undoubtedly a big factor in its success. If nothing else, it gave ARM board makers a boot in the behind and got them to build boards that don't cost an arm and a leg. We wouldn't have sub-$100 Jetson Nanos if the Pi hadn't blazed a trail.

Sebb767 5y ago

> You spend 60 or 80€ on three or four RPIs, No. I agree with you that the RPI is a great experiment board, but usually you don't get them for below 30€ (20 for the zeros). Then you need an SD card (10€) and probably power supply. Add on a case and some electronics if you're fancy, then add 5€ shipping. I like the RPi, don't get me wrong. But something like a RPI cluster easily ends up in the 150-200€ range, even in it's most minimal form. The GP is right that, unless you're going specifically for having a cluster or GPIO, other options are simply more performance for your money.

rualca 5y ago
> No. I agree with you that the RPI is a great experiment board, but usually you don't get them for below 30€ (20 for the zeros). You should really look up those prices because your assertions don't match reality. I am, right now, looking at the page of a distributor listed in raspberry pi which sells raspberry pi 3+ for 28€ plus 4€ shipping. Amazon sells 16GB SD cards for 5€, and a charger is really the least of your budget problems. The same store sells Raspberry Pi Zero W for 11€ a pop, and Raspberry Pi Zeros for 5€. Hell, a while ago there were magazines giving away raspberry pi zeros with the mag.
- Sebb767 5y ago
  I'd like to see that reseller. A german comparison site list 37+4 Euros for the 3B+ [0] and 39+4 for the 4 2GB [1]. Reichelt, an official reseller, list 37 Euros for the 3 [2]. Amazon lists 66 Euros for the 4 4GB [4]. [0] https://geizhals.de/raspberry-pi-3-modell-b-a1785657.html https://geizhals.de/raspberry-pi-3-modell-b-a1785657.html [1] https://geizhals.de/raspberry-pi-4-modell-b-a2081127.html https://geizhals.de/raspberry-pi-4-modell-b-a2081127.html [2] https://www.reichelt.de/de/de/raspberry-pi-3-b-4x-1-2-ghz-1-gb-ram-wlan-bt-raspberry-pi-3-p164977.html?search=raspberry+pi&&r=1 https://www.reichelt.de/de/de/raspberry-pi-3-b-4x-1-2-ghz-1-... [3] https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Raspberry-ARM-Cortex-A72-WLAN-ac-Bluetooth-Micro-HDMI-Single/dp/B07TC2BK1X/ https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Raspberry-ARM-Cortex-A72-WLAN-ac-... > Amazon sells 16GB SD cards for 5€, and a charger is really the least of your budget problems. A 5 port USB charger is 25 Euro: https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Anker-PowerPort-Port-Charger-Single/dp/B00VUGOSWY/ref=sr_1_3 https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Anker-PowerPort-Port-Charger-Sing... You can go a bit cheaper, but not too much in order to avoid brown-outs (very possible with the Pi 3/4, but 1A charger struggle even with the older models). You can save on the SD cards, if disk performance does not matter, I give you that. Still, these small amounts add up quickly. When we're talking about a sub-100 Euro project, throwing in 20 euro for the charger and another 20 for SD cards quickly drains your budget. Even with your pricing, a Pi 3+ cluster would run us (28+5)*[3/4]+4+20 = 123/156 Euros - close to double the original estimate and without any cables whatsoever. I don't mean to say the Pi is overly expensive - it's good value for what it is. But these small project do quickly add up and when you don't play it's strengths, you end up in a situation where you pay more money for the Pi project than more powerful hardware would have cost you in the beginning.