6 ms·

I used to watch Bourdain on the Travel channel. I've never traveled, Bourdain was my escape. Sidnote, has anyone seen what the Travel channel has turned into? T

by hrh 5y ago

I used to watch Bourdain on the Travel channel. I've never traveled, Bourdain was my escape. Sidnote, has anyone seen what the Travel channel has turned into? This thing where every show is about UFOs or bigfoot (bigfeet) or goatman. I can't tell if they're scripted or they are genuinely taking advantage of the people they are interviewing. Then they'll drop an ad for you to subscribe to Discovery plus every six minutes (they do this on all their networks). Kind of interesting to watch whatever that business model is. Well, enough of why Bourdain killed himself. Bourdain was brilliant. He was witty, charming, but more importantly you genuinely knew that he cared about every single person he was sitting down and talking to. He always, always respected them and his audience and he never treated you as anything but a friend. When the news came out about his death I was not surprised. I know what depression is like, the secret suffering (I don't want or need pity comment)s. You can be open and loving and happy on the outside but every hour wonder what's the point of helping people hurt other people, which is ultimately what most of us do. I mean, we couldn't all eat and travel like Bourdain without destroying the planet (worse) and you know he was self-aware to know that. He probablys aid it. Bourdain lived a very large life, he'd seen enough like Hemingway and Wallace and Bennington and...there's a pattern here but I'm sure I'm leaving lots of people out...had before him. But the way the world reacted to his death. The absolute incomprehension, the continued downplaying of issues like depression even on "educated" places like HN, the conspiracy theories (happy people don't kill themselves - ergo child trafficking), the way we as people and societies bicker about the smallest and stupidest of things and will kill each other over it...I'm certain that's why Bourdain was the person he was, and I thank him for all he taught me and others.

itronitron 5y ago
>> I can't tell if they're scripted or they are genuinely taking advantage of the people they are interviewing. A friend of mine used to live in a small town near another small town where one of the episodes of Ghost Hunters was filmed. That particular episode focused on an "old historic hotel built in the 1800's" and the frontier-era ghosts haunting it. It was a very compelling episode but I found out after watching it that the hotel had been built only a few years prior to the episode being filmed. My personal opinion is that most of those shows are entirely scripted.
- handrous 5y ago
  > My personal opinion is that most of those shows are entirely scripted. Practically all of them are. It is way more expensive to shoot compelling reality TV that's at all resembles what the term implies. Uncertainty about what you'll get, and capturing a real narrative taking way, way more time, means your productions costs are many times what they would be for something that's mostly scripted from scratch, or built out of (scripted) re-creations of things that already happened.
louwrentius 5y ago
Thanks for writing this.
mst 5y ago
This really resonated at the time: https://www.popehat.com/2018/06/10/randazza-trying-to-make-sense-of-bourdain/ https://www.popehat.com/2018/06/10/randazza-trying-to-make-s... I've often used the phrase "trying to outrun the fire" to myself. Maybe that's what happened to him, maybe not, but either way that blog post hit me in the feels.
machinehermiter 5y ago
The incomprehension with his death for me was what he came from in his 40s and his daughter. I was depressed and addicted most of my 20s and Bourdain was like some kind of mythical hero in that regard. You could still be a junkie in your 40s and soar to having beers with Obama. His death still worries me in a sense for my own life that I still want to do a ton with my life but I don't want to do quite everything. There needs to always be something to dream about, something needs to be left unfulfilled. I can completely get for Bourdain that at the end there was no fix left. He had literally done everything in his life possible to do. What could he possibly dream about at the end? I am sure that is a much darker place then what it would seem on the surface. "Instead of killing myself, I can do anything so I should do X." He literally ran X dry.
- grasshopperpurp 5y ago
  >What could he possibly dream about at the end? Balance. Not to be flippant, and I also enjoy AB's work, but no one thing or set of things is never the answer to sustainable peace of mind. Ironically, one thing that made AB's character so appealing was his balance of ex-junkie hardness and childlike wonder. There's a great Velvet Underground song, I Found a Reason, with the lyric, 'Oh, I do believe / If you don't like things you leave / For some place you've never gone before.' That place isn't necessarily a 'place.' No one ever does everything. You will die with meat still left on the bone. Take comfort in that.
- okareaman 5y ago
  > Argento is portrayed as a human intoxicant, with whom Bourdain developed an all-consuming infatuation... They describe how she influenced his decision to abruptly sack a longtime colleague, and his devastation when she began to tire of his attentions and romantically pull away. I was also depressed and addicted, then when I quit I met a woman who wasn't good for me. My feelings for her became another addiction. This article clarified for me the reason he killed himself. I can totally understand not wanting to go on living without the woman you love and need in a very intense way, and worse, a woman that torments you.
heymijo 5y ago
> Sidnote, has anyone seen what the Travel channel has turned into? This thing where every show is about UFOs or bigfoot (bigfeet) or goatman. There's something here to unpack about audiences (humanity even?) if this is what networks devolve into. Looking at you History Channel
- elliekelly 5y ago
  I think it has a lot to do with the type of people who binge watch cable TV these days. The majority of younger people and more tech savvy people (and both of those groups tending to be more media literate people) have moved to Netflix, Hulu, Prime, HBO, etc. They don’t watch the travel channel or the history channel anymore. It’s kind of like the facebook-ification of cable content to keep viewers coming back and it seems there’s a subset of American boomers who will eagerly consume conspiracy content.
  - hrh 5y ago
    It's definitely this. I'm an old millenial which is why I still like TV but you're running into content making fun of this stuff if youre watching HBO, etc. Though, both Hulu and YouTube TV carry these channels and shows I'm talking about.
  - heymijo 5y ago
    Anecdotally but don’t write off the younger generation. I was teaching 6th grade social studies a few years ago. Flat earth, ancient aliens, and other conspiracy theories are in their mindshare. YouTube was their medium. I think you nailed it for the cable tv audience though.
heymijo 5y ago
> the secret suffering You packed a lot of insight and wisdom into your comment. Regarding secret suffering, I know someone who is so good at it that they make it easy to forget on a conscious level that they suffer from depression. It's insidious. The past year or so has really illuminated the "it doesn't matter until it affects me personally mentality (or I don't understand it until it does)." Seems like that can be applied to depression. I posit lack of understanding about depression is exacerbated about our nascent understanding of how our minds even work. Combined this makes me think we, as a species, are not very educated about depression. What do you think and/or what do you think we could do better so we don't continue to have an "absolute incomprehension, the continued downplaying of issues like depression"?
- hrh 5y ago
  I'd imagine a lot of people are like this, and I'd imagine HN is overrepresented by this, but I just really feel emotions. When I'm on and am really into something I get hyperfocus and feel like the world is my oyster, but inevitably that high is going to end and if I'm not careful with certain emotional situations I put myself in (romantic relationships), I can reach that low of lows where I honestly just don't want to be here. I mean I guess we all feel this at times, I don't want to imagine it is special, but there are just times in those lows where every doorframe and every rope looks like an out. I absolutely am not interested in it and I know that if I stick it out, that time is going to pass, but I absolutely feel it deep in my stomach and I understand when people who are in that state exacerbate it (if it's alcohol, don't drink alcohol) and we get these tragedies. For me, personally, this is the first time in 15 years that I've felt normal, which is to say my entire adult life. Some of that is just growing up, but it took a few tries with psychologists (the second much more successful than the first), being cognizant of what issues put me in a funk and avoiding them, getting the appropriate medication (for depression this is invaluable - the main thing it does for me is make sure those valleys aren't so low) and then within the last year realizing that I might also be adhd (all this shit is comorbid) and seeing a pyschiatrist and getting on the proper meds for that. I know we've got our Scientologists and resident HNers that think the healthcare industry is just a joke, but my counselours have always been my friends, it's as much me guiding and us learning about what works and doesn't work as them, and you know, it's been life-changing. This last part is in response to your "we don't know" comment. We have no fucking clue on the brain works, which is why I'm even saying this. I see people that are ashamed to take medication or admit they have. But the depression is never going to completely go away. Two books that have given me a lot of hope, taught me a lot are: > https://www.amazon.com/Lincolns-Melancholy-Depression-Challenged-President/dp/0618773444 https://www.amazon.com/Lincolns-Melancholy-Depression-Challe... > https://www.amazon.com/First-Rate-Madness-Uncovering-Between-Leadership/dp/0143121332 https://www.amazon.com/First-Rate-Madness-Uncovering-Between... I'm sure someone's going to say that here's popsci, but I dunno, was good stuff for me. Great insights into mental disorders and how they can be worked around, even embraced. This is all feeling way too male...I guess a final thing that's been vital for me (and again, just getting older) is the power of empathy. I think there are a few shows like Mad Men or HaCF which really show a variety of people working through issues like this.
jfengel 5y ago
you genuinely knew that he cared about every single person he was sitting down and talking to I wonder if that's the impression that he crafted for TV. I read his book Kitchen Confidential, and the thing that struck me about his characterization of restaurant kitchens is that he always seemed to be surrounded by terrible people. He portrayed that as universal, which is not my experience in them. Some are bad; others are not. And I notice that the common factor in all of his bad experiences in kitchens is him. Restaurant kitchens are, indeed, hot, unpleasant, fast-moving, and potentially dangerous places. They pay very badly for incredibly demanding, exhausting work. It does attract a certain kind of adrenaline junkie. But it also attracts a lot of kind, compassionate people who just want to make food that people enjoy. They're not all about taking cocaine and drinking and quitting on no notice. I'm glad he presented a more thoughtful version of himself on his TV show. I didn't like the person he presented in his book. I would like to think that the former is more true to him than the latter. But I can say that his death didn't come as a surprise to me, based on what I read in his writings. I don't mean that to be cruel. His work touched you and I'm glad for that.

by hrh 5y ago

itronitron 5y ago

>> I can't tell if they're scripted or they are genuinely taking advantage of the people they are interviewing. A friend of mine used to live in a small town near another small town where one of the episodes of Ghost Hunters was filmed. That particular episode focused on an "old historic hotel built in the 1800's" and the frontier-era ghosts haunting it. It was a very compelling episode but I found out after watching it that the hotel had been built only a few years prior to the episode being filmed. My personal opinion is that most of those shows are entirely scripted.

handrous 5y ago
> My personal opinion is that most of those shows are entirely scripted. Practically all of them are. It is way more expensive to shoot compelling reality TV that's at all resembles what the term implies. Uncertainty about what you'll get, and capturing a real narrative taking way, way more time, means your productions costs are many times what they would be for something that's mostly scripted from scratch, or built out of (scripted) re-creations of things that already happened.

louwrentius 5y ago

Thanks for writing this.

mst 5y ago

This really resonated at the time: https://www.popehat.com/2018/06/10/randazza-trying-to-make-sense-of-bourdain/ https://www.popehat.com/2018/06/10/randazza-trying-to-make-s... I've often used the phrase "trying to outrun the fire" to myself. Maybe that's what happened to him, maybe not, but either way that blog post hit me in the feels.

machinehermiter 5y ago

The incomprehension with his death for me was what he came from in his 40s and his daughter. I was depressed and addicted most of my 20s and Bourdain was like some kind of mythical hero in that regard. You could still be a junkie in your 40s and soar to having beers with Obama. His death still worries me in a sense for my own life that I still want to do a ton with my life but I don't want to do quite everything. There needs to always be something to dream about, something needs to be left unfulfilled. I can completely get for Bourdain that at the end there was no fix left. He had literally done everything in his life possible to do. What could he possibly dream about at the end? I am sure that is a much darker place then what it would seem on the surface. "Instead of killing myself, I can do anything so I should do X." He literally ran X dry.

grasshopperpurp 5y ago
>What could he possibly dream about at the end? Balance. Not to be flippant, and I also enjoy AB's work, but no one thing or set of things is never the answer to sustainable peace of mind. Ironically, one thing that made AB's character so appealing was his balance of ex-junkie hardness and childlike wonder. There's a great Velvet Underground song, I Found a Reason, with the lyric, 'Oh, I do believe / If you don't like things you leave / For some place you've never gone before.' That place isn't necessarily a 'place.' No one ever does everything. You will die with meat still left on the bone. Take comfort in that.
okareaman 5y ago
> Argento is portrayed as a human intoxicant, with whom Bourdain developed an all-consuming infatuation... They describe how she influenced his decision to abruptly sack a longtime colleague, and his devastation when she began to tire of his attentions and romantically pull away. I was also depressed and addicted, then when I quit I met a woman who wasn't good for me. My feelings for her became another addiction. This article clarified for me the reason he killed himself. I can totally understand not wanting to go on living without the woman you love and need in a very intense way, and worse, a woman that torments you.

heymijo 5y ago

> Sidnote, has anyone seen what the Travel channel has turned into? This thing where every show is about UFOs or bigfoot (bigfeet) or goatman. There's something here to unpack about audiences (humanity even?) if this is what networks devolve into. Looking at you History Channel

elliekelly 5y ago
I think it has a lot to do with the type of people who binge watch cable TV these days. The majority of younger people and more tech savvy people (and both of those groups tending to be more media literate people) have moved to Netflix, Hulu, Prime, HBO, etc. They don’t watch the travel channel or the history channel anymore. It’s kind of like the facebook-ification of cable content to keep viewers coming back and it seems there’s a subset of American boomers who will eagerly consume conspiracy content.
- hrh 5y ago
  It's definitely this. I'm an old millenial which is why I still like TV but you're running into content making fun of this stuff if youre watching HBO, etc. Though, both Hulu and YouTube TV carry these channels and shows I'm talking about.
- heymijo 5y ago
  Anecdotally but don’t write off the younger generation. I was teaching 6th grade social studies a few years ago. Flat earth, ancient aliens, and other conspiracy theories are in their mindshare. YouTube was their medium. I think you nailed it for the cable tv audience though.

heymijo 5y ago

> the secret suffering You packed a lot of insight and wisdom into your comment. Regarding secret suffering, I know someone who is so good at it that they make it easy to forget on a conscious level that they suffer from depression. It's insidious. The past year or so has really illuminated the "it doesn't matter until it affects me personally mentality (or I don't understand it until it does)." Seems like that can be applied to depression. I posit lack of understanding about depression is exacerbated about our nascent understanding of how our minds even work. Combined this makes me think we, as a species, are not very educated about depression. What do you think and/or what do you think we could do better so we don't continue to have an "absolute incomprehension, the continued downplaying of issues like depression"?

hrh 5y ago
I'd imagine a lot of people are like this, and I'd imagine HN is overrepresented by this, but I just really feel emotions. When I'm on and am really into something I get hyperfocus and feel like the world is my oyster, but inevitably that high is going to end and if I'm not careful with certain emotional situations I put myself in (romantic relationships), I can reach that low of lows where I honestly just don't want to be here. I mean I guess we all feel this at times, I don't want to imagine it is special, but there are just times in those lows where every doorframe and every rope looks like an out. I absolutely am not interested in it and I know that if I stick it out, that time is going to pass, but I absolutely feel it deep in my stomach and I understand when people who are in that state exacerbate it (if it's alcohol, don't drink alcohol) and we get these tragedies. For me, personally, this is the first time in 15 years that I've felt normal, which is to say my entire adult life. Some of that is just growing up, but it took a few tries with psychologists (the second much more successful than the first), being cognizant of what issues put me in a funk and avoiding them, getting the appropriate medication (for depression this is invaluable - the main thing it does for me is make sure those valleys aren't so low) and then within the last year realizing that I might also be adhd (all this shit is comorbid) and seeing a pyschiatrist and getting on the proper meds for that. I know we've got our Scientologists and resident HNers that think the healthcare industry is just a joke, but my counselours have always been my friends, it's as much me guiding and us learning about what works and doesn't work as them, and you know, it's been life-changing. This last part is in response to your "we don't know" comment. We have no fucking clue on the brain works, which is why I'm even saying this. I see people that are ashamed to take medication or admit they have. But the depression is never going to completely go away. Two books that have given me a lot of hope, taught me a lot are: > https://www.amazon.com/Lincolns-Melancholy-Depression-Challenged-President/dp/0618773444 https://www.amazon.com/Lincolns-Melancholy-Depression-Challe... > https://www.amazon.com/First-Rate-Madness-Uncovering-Between-Leadership/dp/0143121332 https://www.amazon.com/First-Rate-Madness-Uncovering-Between... I'm sure someone's going to say that here's popsci, but I dunno, was good stuff for me. Great insights into mental disorders and how they can be worked around, even embraced. This is all feeling way too male...I guess a final thing that's been vital for me (and again, just getting older) is the power of empathy. I think there are a few shows like Mad Men or HaCF which really show a variety of people working through issues like this.

jfengel 5y ago

you genuinely knew that he cared about every single person he was sitting down and talking to I wonder if that's the impression that he crafted for TV. I read his book Kitchen Confidential, and the thing that struck me about his characterization of restaurant kitchens is that he always seemed to be surrounded by terrible people. He portrayed that as universal, which is not my experience in them. Some are bad; others are not. And I notice that the common factor in all of his bad experiences in kitchens is him. Restaurant kitchens are, indeed, hot, unpleasant, fast-moving, and potentially dangerous places. They pay very badly for incredibly demanding, exhausting work. It does attract a certain kind of adrenaline junkie. But it also attracts a lot of kind, compassionate people who just want to make food that people enjoy. They're not all about taking cocaine and drinking and quitting on no notice. I'm glad he presented a more thoughtful version of himself on his TV show. I didn't like the person he presented in his book. I would like to think that the former is more true to him than the latter. But I can say that his death didn't come as a surprise to me, based on what I read in his writings. I don't mean that to be cruel. His work touched you and I'm glad for that.