4 ms·

It’s interesting that they demarcate affordability as a single minimum wage earner needing a two bedroom apartment.

by frugalmail 5y ago

wumpus 5y ago
That's not new in these sorts of studies, it flows from the realization that people have children.
- b9a2cab5 5y ago
  You need a $150k salary to _survive_ in a 2bd apartment in SF or NYC. This study is a garbage take. The reason minimum wage workers can't afford rent is not because minimum wage is too low (because in big cities it's way above $15/h and enough to pay for food+other living expenses, minus rent) but because rent is too high. And that's caused by NIMBYism (in this case of the liberal variety but it's everywhere in America), not low minimum wage. If you literally just demolished all the shitty 2-3 floor townhomes in SF and replaced them with 20 floor towers like you see in Asian countries the entire problem is solved. Fun fact: a Berkeley professor named Robert Reich often likes to go on on Twitter about wealth inequality but he himself protested the construction of low income housing next to his home.
  - jjulius 5y ago
    > The reason minimum wage workers can't afford rent is not because minimum wage is too low (because in big cities it's way above $15/h... Using your examples, SF is currently at $16.32/hr and NYC is at $15/hr. I don't know that I would call either of those wages "way above $15/h".
    - b9a2cab5 5y ago
      And what are real wages for restaurant workers and other minimum wage tier jobs? If you take a look at SF, Oakland, NYC, or even mid-west cities like Chicago, they're higher than minimum wage by 20-25%, even at large chain restaurants.
  - endisneigh 5y ago
    No you don’t (at least nyc), lmao. Furthermore saying anything along the lines of - “it’s not that you don’t make enough money, it’s that things are too expensive!” Is clearly pointless.
    - b9a2cab5 5y ago
      If the same number of people are chasing the same number of apartments but making more money, the natural conclusion is that the price of the apartments will go up. If the same number of people are chasing _more_ apartments, the price of the apartments will go down (ignoring induced demand, but I think this is minor for NYC/SF). You can't just legislate a higher wage because in the long run rents will stabilize at a higher level to compensate and all you've done is make landlords richer and fuck over every small business in the city. You need to actually have more supply.
  - tablespoon 5y ago
    Quoth the OP: > There is no state, county or city in the country where a full-time, minimum-wage worker working 40 hours a week can afford a two-bedroom rental, a report from the National Low Income Housing Coalition showed. That includes SF, and it includes some unfashionable place you've probably never heard of where the rent is literally the cheapest in the nation. This probably isn't the right thread to beat the dead horse of SF NIMBYism and push fantasies of a one-size-fits all solution of densely-packed 20 story concrete apartment blocks.
MauroIksem 5y ago
There is more in the article that covers the 1bd scenario. Reading more than the headline would help.
- refurb 5y ago
  Someone needs to earn $21/hr, or $42,000 to afford a 1 bedroom? No. They need that much to afford a 1 bed comfortably.
acharp 5y ago
Did you miss the line literally underneath it? > And a $20.40 "housing wage" would be needed for a one-bedroom.

It’s interesting that they demarcate affordability as a single minimum wage earner needing a two bedroom apartment.

wumpus 5y ago

That's not new in these sorts of studies, it flows from the realization that people have children.

b9a2cab5 5y ago
You need a $150k salary to _survive_ in a 2bd apartment in SF or NYC. This study is a garbage take. The reason minimum wage workers can't afford rent is not because minimum wage is too low (because in big cities it's way above $15/h and enough to pay for food+other living expenses, minus rent) but because rent is too high. And that's caused by NIMBYism (in this case of the liberal variety but it's everywhere in America), not low minimum wage. If you literally just demolished all the shitty 2-3 floor townhomes in SF and replaced them with 20 floor towers like you see in Asian countries the entire problem is solved. Fun fact: a Berkeley professor named Robert Reich often likes to go on on Twitter about wealth inequality but he himself protested the construction of low income housing next to his home.
- jjulius 5y ago
  > The reason minimum wage workers can't afford rent is not because minimum wage is too low (because in big cities it's way above $15/h... Using your examples, SF is currently at $16.32/hr and NYC is at $15/hr. I don't know that I would call either of those wages "way above $15/h".
  - b9a2cab5 5y ago
    And what are real wages for restaurant workers and other minimum wage tier jobs? If you take a look at SF, Oakland, NYC, or even mid-west cities like Chicago, they're higher than minimum wage by 20-25%, even at large chain restaurants.
- endisneigh 5y ago
  No you don’t (at least nyc), lmao. Furthermore saying anything along the lines of - “it’s not that you don’t make enough money, it’s that things are too expensive!” Is clearly pointless.
  - b9a2cab5 5y ago
    If the same number of people are chasing the same number of apartments but making more money, the natural conclusion is that the price of the apartments will go up. If the same number of people are chasing _more_ apartments, the price of the apartments will go down (ignoring induced demand, but I think this is minor for NYC/SF). You can't just legislate a higher wage because in the long run rents will stabilize at a higher level to compensate and all you've done is make landlords richer and fuck over every small business in the city. You need to actually have more supply.
- tablespoon 5y ago
  Quoth the OP: > There is no state, county or city in the country where a full-time, minimum-wage worker working 40 hours a week can afford a two-bedroom rental, a report from the National Low Income Housing Coalition showed. That includes SF, and it includes some unfashionable place you've probably never heard of where the rent is literally the cheapest in the nation. This probably isn't the right thread to beat the dead horse of SF NIMBYism and push fantasies of a one-size-fits all solution of densely-packed 20 story concrete apartment blocks.

MauroIksem 5y ago

There is more in the article that covers the 1bd scenario. Reading more than the headline would help.

refurb 5y ago
Someone needs to earn $21/hr, or $42,000 to afford a 1 bedroom? No. They need that much to afford a 1 bed comfortably.

acharp 5y ago

Did you miss the line literally underneath it? > And a $20.40 "housing wage" would be needed for a one-bedroom.