3 ms·

> This is not really a personal complaint. My situation is still quite privileged. It should be a personal complaint. You had precisely 0 privilege.

pc86 5y ago
For some reason everyone who isn't born into crushing poverty, and/or didn't move here without speaking the language or looking and sounding like a natural-born citizen, and/or doesn't come from an underfunded inner city as an obvious racial minority feels the need to acknowledge some ephemeral privilege that made everything easy for them. I don't have a problem with this per se, and at times it's even a good exercise from an intellectual standpoint, but it's at about a 12/10 at the moment.
- ludamad 5y ago
  2/10 and 12/10 seem to be the dials people get set to after reacting to news/experiences
andi999 5y ago
I thought his privilege was beeing an US citizen, if not the option of beeing deported would have a high propability. (technically a US citizen cannot be refused entry AFAIK)
- lotsofpulp 5y ago
  Technically, a US citizen can get sent to a secret prison via secret court orders and have no recourse. Or just be murdered.
  - meepmorp 5y ago
    How often are people remanded to secret prisons and/or are just murdered because the computer says their passport photo doesn't match their face? Why bring it up? Technically, a previously unknown near-earth object could wipe out most life on earth at lunchtime. Odds are, I'll still have that 2 PM meeting, though.
    - dkdk8283 5y ago
      Atrocities are committed but my sense is a photo mismatch won’t be the catalyst. I’d go further and say it happens less often then you might think. Did you know CBP agents are trained to get you emotional, piss you off, and treat you like shit? It’s an effective and quick way to get someone on edge and maybe reveal something to be investigated. Nervous behavior. CBP officers go through therapy to deal with this. Fight fire with fire. I would make it clear (respectfully) the situation is ridiculous and push for resolution in my favor. I was once asked for a second photo ID at the border and I didn’t have one. The officer found this very suspicious. I did get kind of pissed and asked him what kind of idiot takes every photo id they have abroad. What if it’s lost or stolen? I was waived through.
      - ajford 5y ago
        Buddy of mine from college flies with his US passport at all times, even for domestic flights, because he's of Arab decent and constantly gets hassled for it. So one time we're flying domestic as a group to set up some equipment for a research project. He gets pulled aside by a couple of white TSA agents as part of a "random inspection", out of a line of about 20 people, mostly white or light complected. He starts getting questioned about where he's flying, why, etc. Then they ask to see his ID and boarding pass. Hands them his passport, state DL, and boarding pass, and they start going off on him as to why he's got his passport for a domestic flight, how that looks suspicious and such. He responds with "Well, I get stopped for looking Arab every time I fly, so this is a much easier way to prove I'm a US citizen." They stop for a moment and look around at everyone watching, tell him to have a good day and walk away. I'll never forget that encounter.
        wkimeria 5y ago
        sighs in "all the damn time" Privilege is real, a little anecdote. I'm black, I've had quite my shares of DWB stops and bad cop experiences (I detailed some of them on Twitter and in this subsequent interview). That Twitter thread blew up because so many black people chimed in (from college students to famous journalists to famous musicians) detailing their ridiculous experiences with cops. https://www.boredpanda.com/ridiculous-reason-black-people-stopped-by-police/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=organic https://www.boredpanda.com/ridiculous-reason-black-people-st... One of the more "interesting" one was I was stopped by a cop in a suburb of Boston, I think it was Newton or Newtonville). The reason given was that "I was adhering too strictly to the rules" which made me suspicious. This was a read that had a 35 MPH limit and I was strictly observing that limit. So the fact that I was following the law made me suspicious. But the reason I was following the law (even when other drivers were speeding) was because cops will use any ridiculous reason to pull me over. Can't win for losing. Privilege is real and I see it every time I compare how I get treated with how my white friends (who share the same socio-economic profile and other markers to me) are treated. I dumped a white acquaintance I was giving a lift to Manchester NH on the side of the road when he pulled out a joint as I was driving and got belligerent with me when I got mad at him for endangering me and refused to put it out or throw it out. He just could not get it through his head why I, a black person at much higher risk of getting stopped by cops would take umbrage at his stupidity. I'm 47. I have never done weed, not because I think there is anything wrong with it, but because given how often I got stopped by cops (driving or even simply walking), all it would have taken was for me to have a joint on me for it to ruin my life. My white friends had no such fear. When I was younger and in college I used to work security, and sometimes I'd do security for concert venues. I saw how the cops treated predominantly black patrons vs white patrons. With black patrons, the cops felt their role was to intimidate and they tended to escalate situations and just generally be rude and aggressive. With white patrons, they went super easy (I worked security at the Fleet Center in Boston for a Fish New Years Concert (1995 or 1996 I think) (the band put on an amazing show and made me a fan of theirs that night)). White concert goers were walking around openly smoking pot (I drove home in the morning with my uniform reeking of weed) and the only things the cops would do was to occasionally ask patrons to put them out. Totally different from when the crowd was predominantly black (no black person in Boston at that time their right mind would even THINK! of lighing up a joint in front of a cop). The facial recognition issue is particulary vexing/scary for me (Netflix has a great documentary called "Coded Bias" about this) because there are 2 things that are true 1: Facial recognition systems are incredibly terrible at telling black faces apart 2: Any rule or perceived rule violation is going to be enforced much more harshly against POC. There is wiggle room and entreaties about being mis-identified are likely to fall on deaf years A good example of this confluence is the black girl who was put out of skating rink (at night, thereby putting her in danger) because the facial recognition system mis-identified her. The only saving grace is the venue did not call the cops (I'm pretty sure that things would have gone badly for the teenager) https://www.newsweek.com/black-teen-barred-skating-rink-after-facial-recognition-camera-misidentified-her-1610023 https://www.newsweek.com/black-teen-barred-skating-rink-afte...

pc86 5y ago

For some reason everyone who isn't born into crushing poverty, and/or didn't move here without speaking the language or looking and sounding like a natural-born citizen, and/or doesn't come from an underfunded inner city as an obvious racial minority feels the need to acknowledge some ephemeral privilege that made everything easy for them. I don't have a problem with this per se, and at times it's even a good exercise from an intellectual standpoint, but it's at about a 12/10 at the moment.

ludamad 5y ago
2/10 and 12/10 seem to be the dials people get set to after reacting to news/experiences

andi999 5y ago

I thought his privilege was beeing an US citizen, if not the option of beeing deported would have a high propability. (technically a US citizen cannot be refused entry AFAIK)

lotsofpulp 5y ago
Technically, a US citizen can get sent to a secret prison via secret court orders and have no recourse. Or just be murdered.
- meepmorp 5y ago
  How often are people remanded to secret prisons and/or are just murdered because the computer says their passport photo doesn't match their face? Why bring it up? Technically, a previously unknown near-earth object could wipe out most life on earth at lunchtime. Odds are, I'll still have that 2 PM meeting, though.
  - dkdk8283 5y ago
    Atrocities are committed but my sense is a photo mismatch won’t be the catalyst. I’d go further and say it happens less often then you might think. Did you know CBP agents are trained to get you emotional, piss you off, and treat you like shit? It’s an effective and quick way to get someone on edge and maybe reveal something to be investigated. Nervous behavior. CBP officers go through therapy to deal with this. Fight fire with fire. I would make it clear (respectfully) the situation is ridiculous and push for resolution in my favor. I was once asked for a second photo ID at the border and I didn’t have one. The officer found this very suspicious. I did get kind of pissed and asked him what kind of idiot takes every photo id they have abroad. What if it’s lost or stolen? I was waived through.
    - ajford 5y ago
      Buddy of mine from college flies with his US passport at all times, even for domestic flights, because he's of Arab decent and constantly gets hassled for it. So one time we're flying domestic as a group to set up some equipment for a research project. He gets pulled aside by a couple of white TSA agents as part of a "random inspection", out of a line of about 20 people, mostly white or light complected. He starts getting questioned about where he's flying, why, etc. Then they ask to see his ID and boarding pass. Hands them his passport, state DL, and boarding pass, and they start going off on him as to why he's got his passport for a domestic flight, how that looks suspicious and such. He responds with "Well, I get stopped for looking Arab every time I fly, so this is a much easier way to prove I'm a US citizen." They stop for a moment and look around at everyone watching, tell him to have a good day and walk away. I'll never forget that encounter.
      - wkimeria 5y ago
        sighs in "all the damn time" Privilege is real, a little anecdote. I'm black, I've had quite my shares of DWB stops and bad cop experiences (I detailed some of them on Twitter and in this subsequent interview). That Twitter thread blew up because so many black people chimed in (from college students to famous journalists to famous musicians) detailing their ridiculous experiences with cops. https://www.boredpanda.com/ridiculous-reason-black-people-stopped-by-police/?utm_source=google&utm_medium=organic&utm_campaign=organic https://www.boredpanda.com/ridiculous-reason-black-people-st... One of the more "interesting" one was I was stopped by a cop in a suburb of Boston, I think it was Newton or Newtonville). The reason given was that "I was adhering too strictly to the rules" which made me suspicious. This was a read that had a 35 MPH limit and I was strictly observing that limit. So the fact that I was following the law made me suspicious. But the reason I was following the law (even when other drivers were speeding) was because cops will use any ridiculous reason to pull me over. Can't win for losing. Privilege is real and I see it every time I compare how I get treated with how my white friends (who share the same socio-economic profile and other markers to me) are treated. I dumped a white acquaintance I was giving a lift to Manchester NH on the side of the road when he pulled out a joint as I was driving and got belligerent with me when I got mad at him for endangering me and refused to put it out or throw it out. He just could not get it through his head why I, a black person at much higher risk of getting stopped by cops would take umbrage at his stupidity. I'm 47. I have never done weed, not because I think there is anything wrong with it, but because given how often I got stopped by cops (driving or even simply walking), all it would have taken was for me to have a joint on me for it to ruin my life. My white friends had no such fear. When I was younger and in college I used to work security, and sometimes I'd do security for concert venues. I saw how the cops treated predominantly black patrons vs white patrons. With black patrons, the cops felt their role was to intimidate and they tended to escalate situations and just generally be rude and aggressive. With white patrons, they went super easy (I worked security at the Fleet Center in Boston for a Fish New Years Concert (1995 or 1996 I think) (the band put on an amazing show and made me a fan of theirs that night)). White concert goers were walking around openly smoking pot (I drove home in the morning with my uniform reeking of weed) and the only things the cops would do was to occasionally ask patrons to put them out. Totally different from when the crowd was predominantly black (no black person in Boston at that time their right mind would even THINK! of lighing up a joint in front of a cop). The facial recognition issue is particulary vexing/scary for me (Netflix has a great documentary called "Coded Bias" about this) because there are 2 things that are true 1: Facial recognition systems are incredibly terrible at telling black faces apart 2: Any rule or perceived rule violation is going to be enforced much more harshly against POC. There is wiggle room and entreaties about being mis-identified are likely to fall on deaf years A good example of this confluence is the black girl who was put out of skating rink (at night, thereby putting her in danger) because the facial recognition system mis-identified her. The only saving grace is the venue did not call the cops (I'm pretty sure that things would have gone badly for the teenager) https://www.newsweek.com/black-teen-barred-skating-rink-after-facial-recognition-camera-misidentified-her-1610023 https://www.newsweek.com/black-teen-barred-skating-rink-afte...