3 ms·

Except, this is not just about America. By and large, countries with more parental leave have lower birth rates. America has less parental leave and has a relat

Except, this is not just about America. By and large, countries with more parental leave have lower birth rates. America has less parental leave and has a relatively higher birth rate.

joshuaissac 5y ago
Or perhaps the introduction of paternity leave is a reaction to lower birth rates?
- ashtonkem 5y ago
  And changing values around what children are for. The idea that children are things to be cherished and invested in (emotionally and economically) is a relatively new idea. Historically children were economic producers for the household, rather than an economic sink.
- iammisc 5y ago
  It's possible, but I think it's the opposite, because as they introduce paternity leaves, fewer children are born. It contributes to the perception of parents as lazy.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
ashtonkem 5y ago
I think Europe’s lower fertility rate is better explained through infant and maternal mortality, two factors that are well studied in how they affect fertility rates. America has a higher infant mortality rate (5.7 vs. 3.3) and maternal death rate (17.6 vs. 6.0) as compared to Europe. These seem like much more plausible reasons for a lower birth rate than average parental leave. And that’s before we even begin analyzing the squishy factors of norms and expectations. All of our preferences are subtly changed by the society in which we live. If you live in a country with low fertility rates, having only one child seems more normal than it might in a region with medium to high fertility. These trends have a tendency to become self reinforcing, as well as drive social programs too. If the norm is that most women will have a single child, society can afford to invest more in that child than they could if she was going to have six on average. Frankly, longer paternal leave strikes me as more of a result rather than a cause of lower fertility rates.

Except, this is not just about America. By and large, countries with more parental leave have lower birth rates. America has less parental leave and has a relatively higher birth rate.

joshuaissac 5y ago

Or perhaps the introduction of paternity leave is a reaction to lower birth rates?

ashtonkem 5y ago
And changing values around what children are for. The idea that children are things to be cherished and invested in (emotionally and economically) is a relatively new idea. Historically children were economic producers for the household, rather than an economic sink.
iammisc 5y ago
It's possible, but I think it's the opposite, because as they introduce paternity leaves, fewer children are born. It contributes to the perception of parents as lazy.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

ashtonkem 5y ago

I think Europe’s lower fertility rate is better explained through infant and maternal mortality, two factors that are well studied in how they affect fertility rates. America has a higher infant mortality rate (5.7 vs. 3.3) and maternal death rate (17.6 vs. 6.0) as compared to Europe. These seem like much more plausible reasons for a lower birth rate than average parental leave. And that’s before we even begin analyzing the squishy factors of norms and expectations. All of our preferences are subtly changed by the society in which we live. If you live in a country with low fertility rates, having only one child seems more normal than it might in a region with medium to high fertility. These trends have a tendency to become self reinforcing, as well as drive social programs too. If the norm is that most women will have a single child, society can afford to invest more in that child than they could if she was going to have six on average. Frankly, longer paternal leave strikes me as more of a result rather than a cause of lower fertility rates.