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> And equated it with this: I came to the comments to find something that further challenged my preconceptions of Ono, as the article did, and then I see the u

> And equated it with this: I came to the comments to find something that further challenged my preconceptions of Ono, as the article did, and then I see the usual cartoonish example carted out when criticizing her, which everyone has already seen before. A better example is elsewhere in the comments: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlY4oxfma_Y https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VlY4oxfma_Y I get it. It's the stuff that only music nerds would be interested in. But I'm not sure why Frank Zappa and Captain Beefheart aren't anywhere near as maligned as Yoko is, but celebrated as mavericks. And even still, experimental artists like these push the artform as a whole forward, to the point that their original innovation becomes co-opted into the mainstream sound and forgotten.

corin_ 5y ago
I suspect there are at least a couple of reasons unrelated to her music (which I admittedly don't know much about myself) why she gets particularly disliked - the fact that Lennon had been part of one of the, if not the, greatest bands of all time, and her influence is blamed for Lennon going off in the musical directions he did, plus I imagine a bit of racism (conscious or unconscious) also comes into play for some people, especially decades ago when she was most relevant.
- h0l0cube 5y ago
  > Lennon had been part of one of the, if not the, greatest bands of all time I think that's the crux of it. What I find particularly confounding, is that these explanations remove the agency from John Lennon. To say that he was tricked by Yoko into bad ideas, is to cast doubts on his artistic merit. Whatever creative chops he had that shaped the Beatles into being more than just some long forgotten cover band, are the same that led him to seek new creative directions. If you listen to punk and post-punk bands in the wake of their collaborations, it seems like he and Yoko were on the right track. I'm certain that if John was alive, there'd be decades more interesting stuff in his back catalogue... definitely better than a cover of "Got My Mind Set On You"
zzzbra 5y ago
Because normies generally aren’t aware of Zappa, Beefheart, et al., whereas Yoko’s improbable connection to what was probably the most popular musical group in the world for much of the 20th Century out her squarely on their radar. Also, honestly, there’s probably a little misogyny at play.
- h0l0cube 5y ago
  I was just pointing out how irrational it is that people are upset with her and John for making experimental music, because, you know, that's what they wanted to do as artists. I didn't mention anything about sexism, but it is telling that the dominant narrative is that John Lennon is some kind of simp. Yoko didn't so much ruin The Beatles, as much as John had an affinity for her take on things and already had his own creative differences with the rest of the band.

corin_ 5y ago

I suspect there are at least a couple of reasons unrelated to her music (which I admittedly don't know much about myself) why she gets particularly disliked - the fact that Lennon had been part of one of the, if not the, greatest bands of all time, and her influence is blamed for Lennon going off in the musical directions he did, plus I imagine a bit of racism (conscious or unconscious) also comes into play for some people, especially decades ago when she was most relevant.

h0l0cube 5y ago
> Lennon had been part of one of the, if not the, greatest bands of all time I think that's the crux of it. What I find particularly confounding, is that these explanations remove the agency from John Lennon. To say that he was tricked by Yoko into bad ideas, is to cast doubts on his artistic merit. Whatever creative chops he had that shaped the Beatles into being more than just some long forgotten cover band, are the same that led him to seek new creative directions. If you listen to punk and post-punk bands in the wake of their collaborations, it seems like he and Yoko were on the right track. I'm certain that if John was alive, there'd be decades more interesting stuff in his back catalogue... definitely better than a cover of "Got My Mind Set On You"

zzzbra 5y ago

Because normies generally aren’t aware of Zappa, Beefheart, et al., whereas Yoko’s improbable connection to what was probably the most popular musical group in the world for much of the 20th Century out her squarely on their radar. Also, honestly, there’s probably a little misogyny at play.

h0l0cube 5y ago
I was just pointing out how irrational it is that people are upset with her and John for making experimental music, because, you know, that's what they wanted to do as artists. I didn't mention anything about sexism, but it is telling that the dominant narrative is that John Lennon is some kind of simp. Yoko didn't so much ruin The Beatles, as much as John had an affinity for her take on things and already had his own creative differences with the rest of the band.