3 ms·

Yep, also over-promising that legacy cars with the "FSD-readiness" upgrade would be guaranteed to support FSD was a completely unforced error. At this point it

Yep, also over-promising that legacy cars with the "FSD-readiness" upgrade would be guaranteed to support FSD was a completely unforced error. At this point it's pretty obvious none of the original "FSD ready" cars Tesla shipped will be able to handle L4/L5 autonomy hardware-wise. Arguably none of the cars currently rolling off the line will be either - others have made the point in the thread: while nobody has really cracked autonomy fully, other players (see: Waymo, Cruise) are clearly much further along with a very different sensor and compute suite than anything Tesla has shipped or currently ships.

CyanLite2 5y ago
I think there's a clear space in North America for a viable L3 system. That is, completely hands-free driving at slow speeds (30-50mph) that allows me to eat a sandwich, respond to a few emails, and text on my phone without having to look at the road or grab the wheel every 15 seconds. Sure, ping me if I'm coming up on a construction zone or if it pours down raining. And don't worry about making unprotected lefts and other tricky situations, I can do that. But just keep the car on the road while I'm making the same drive to the office every morning and let me reclaim some of that commute time.
- meepmorp 5y ago
  I think that sounds good on paper, but the reality would likely be pretty lousy. Humans are still the critical safety component in the system, and all we've done is made it easier for them to have no idea what's going on in a situation before they need to respond to a crisis.
- potatolicious 5y ago
  Isn't what you are describing actually L4 autonomy? At L3 the human still needs to be attentive and ready to intervene at very short notice - so you definitely cannot eat a sandwich or text while in the driver seat. L4 autonomy is where the vehicle is fail-safe. It cannot handle all conditions, but is able to recognize conditions it cannot handle and hand control back to the driver. Importantly if the driver is not responsive to takeover the vehicle can put itself into a safe state (mostly just means pulling over in a safe place). L4 is the minimum at which you can be fully distracted from driving. I don't think Tesla has a viable path to L4 using its current hardware...

CyanLite2 5y ago

I think there's a clear space in North America for a viable L3 system. That is, completely hands-free driving at slow speeds (30-50mph) that allows me to eat a sandwich, respond to a few emails, and text on my phone without having to look at the road or grab the wheel every 15 seconds. Sure, ping me if I'm coming up on a construction zone or if it pours down raining. And don't worry about making unprotected lefts and other tricky situations, I can do that. But just keep the car on the road while I'm making the same drive to the office every morning and let me reclaim some of that commute time.

meepmorp 5y ago
I think that sounds good on paper, but the reality would likely be pretty lousy. Humans are still the critical safety component in the system, and all we've done is made it easier for them to have no idea what's going on in a situation before they need to respond to a crisis.
potatolicious 5y ago
Isn't what you are describing actually L4 autonomy? At L3 the human still needs to be attentive and ready to intervene at very short notice - so you definitely cannot eat a sandwich or text while in the driver seat. L4 autonomy is where the vehicle is fail-safe. It cannot handle all conditions, but is able to recognize conditions it cannot handle and hand control back to the driver. Importantly if the driver is not responsive to takeover the vehicle can put itself into a safe state (mostly just means pulling over in a safe place). L4 is the minimum at which you can be fully distracted from driving. I don't think Tesla has a viable path to L4 using its current hardware...