5 ms·

Out of all the times to mock someone saying that, I don't think "self-driving-but-not-really-car nearly crashes into things and puts the occupants and bystander

Out of all the times to mock someone saying that, I don't think "self-driving-but-not-really-car nearly crashes into things and puts the occupants and bystanders at risk for serious bodily harm as evident by the videos posted above" is one of those times.

optimiz3 5y ago
Wait till you read the stats and see videos of what humans driving cars regularly do!
- ASalazarMX 5y ago
  Still, an autopilot should aim to be a peer with the best drivers, not with mediocre or bad drivers.
  - throwaway0a5e 5y ago
    A peer with average drivers would probably be fine. A peer with average drivers and doing completely nonsensical things every now and then is basically an average driver on their cell phone though and the verdict on that is that it's not fine.
  - optimiz3 5y ago
    It's a limited beta with the goal of discovering error cases.
    - barbazoo 5y ago
      In this case I'd prefer if "discovering error cases" was done without risking actual lives. Injuring someone would not be a valid way discover an error case.
    - junipertea 5y ago
      Beta limited to regular drivers that are not specifically trained testers. Error cases can involve injury or death.
  - colinmhayes 5y ago
    Well if you think of this closed beta as a way for Tesla to collect data about its program's shortcomings it's easy enough to see how releasing could save lives in the long run even it is takes some in the short run. Every day sooner that a 10x better self driving car comes is hundreds of lives saved.
    - camjohnson26 5y ago
      And what if it gets stuck in a local maximum and never improves? Then you lost those extra lives for no reason, which consequently is what I believe has happened. At least 4 people are dead in preventable autopilot crashes, and the real number is probably over 10. For the number of Tesla’s on the road that number is way too high. https://tesladeaths.com https://tesladeaths.com
      - colinmhayes 5y ago
        4 deaths is worth a 1% increased chance of achieving self driving a month earlier. Way more than 400 people a month die in car accidents.
        jazzyjackson 5y ago
        I just don’t understand why people think a robot can improve on this. If you want to save lives, lower speed limits, build out public transit, and don’t hand out drivers licenses like candy.
        colinmhayes 5y ago
        I don't only want to save lives, I want to maximize utility. I think driving less would raise utility, but society disagrees, so this is the next best option.
        jazzyjackson 5y ago
        Right, fair point, people drive 80mph because they have someplace to be. I’m perennially bummed that America can’t figure out how to build high speed rail for less than $100 Million per mile.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- sidibe 5y ago
  Humans do way, way, way better than what we've seen in the FSD beta testers' videos (most of whom are huge Tesla fans)
ASalazarMX 5y ago
It's still appropriate. The issue is using children to appeal to the emotions of parents, as if children were VIP humans. Yes, they are very important people, but mostly to their parents and close relatives.

optimiz3 5y ago

Wait till you read the stats and see videos of what humans driving cars regularly do!

ASalazarMX 5y ago
Still, an autopilot should aim to be a peer with the best drivers, not with mediocre or bad drivers.
- throwaway0a5e 5y ago
  A peer with average drivers would probably be fine. A peer with average drivers and doing completely nonsensical things every now and then is basically an average driver on their cell phone though and the verdict on that is that it's not fine.
- optimiz3 5y ago
  It's a limited beta with the goal of discovering error cases.
  - barbazoo 5y ago
    In this case I'd prefer if "discovering error cases" was done without risking actual lives. Injuring someone would not be a valid way discover an error case.
  - junipertea 5y ago
    Beta limited to regular drivers that are not specifically trained testers. Error cases can involve injury or death.
- colinmhayes 5y ago
  Well if you think of this closed beta as a way for Tesla to collect data about its program's shortcomings it's easy enough to see how releasing could save lives in the long run even it is takes some in the short run. Every day sooner that a 10x better self driving car comes is hundreds of lives saved.
  - camjohnson26 5y ago
    And what if it gets stuck in a local maximum and never improves? Then you lost those extra lives for no reason, which consequently is what I believe has happened. At least 4 people are dead in preventable autopilot crashes, and the real number is probably over 10. For the number of Tesla’s on the road that number is way too high. https://tesladeaths.com https://tesladeaths.com
    - colinmhayes 5y ago
      4 deaths is worth a 1% increased chance of achieving self driving a month earlier. Way more than 400 people a month die in car accidents.
      - jazzyjackson 5y ago
        I just don’t understand why people think a robot can improve on this. If you want to save lives, lower speed limits, build out public transit, and don’t hand out drivers licenses like candy.
        colinmhayes 5y ago
        I don't only want to save lives, I want to maximize utility. I think driving less would raise utility, but society disagrees, so this is the next best option.
        jazzyjackson 5y ago
        Right, fair point, people drive 80mph because they have someplace to be. I’m perennially bummed that America can’t figure out how to build high speed rail for less than $100 Million per mile.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
sidibe 5y ago
Humans do way, way, way better than what we've seen in the FSD beta testers' videos (most of whom are huge Tesla fans)

ASalazarMX 5y ago

It's still appropriate. The issue is using children to appeal to the emotions of parents, as if children were VIP humans. Yes, they are very important people, but mostly to their parents and close relatives.