3 ms·

I was reading this article [1] last night and this paragraph in particular has been bouncing around my head all morning: The crisis, said Eric Kuhn, former gen

by ssully 5y ago

I was reading this article [1] last night and this paragraph in particular has been bouncing around my head all morning: The crisis, said Eric Kuhn, former general manager of the Colorado River Conservation District, can no longer be ignored. “According to Merriam-Webster, a drought is a temporary condition,” he said. What is happening, he suggested, is something more permanent and troubling. “This is aridification.” I think it's just because the framing for so long has been "drought", when it clear that what is going on is probably more severe. [1]: https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2021-07-11/lake-mead-hoover-dam-drought-nevada-arizona-california https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2021-07-11/lake-m...

arbitrary_name 5y ago
I was recently prompted to read 'Cadillac desert' which provides a very interesting summary of the development of water in the west, and the looming challenges. TLDR: it's gonna keep getting worse. Anyway, highly recommend.
treis 5y ago
As much as people like to ridicule the CC deniers for pointing to unusually cold conditions the same side loves to do it when it supports them. For the Colorado River specifically, we established "normal" during an atypically wet time and now that we've gone through actual normal to a dry cycle it's a crisis. It's the normal cyclical behavior of nature and not really Climate Change that's the issue.
- gilbetron 5y ago
  What are you talking about? Do you have some sources explaining this? This just seems like the oft-used, "previously it was an anomaly, we are returning to normal" pseudo-science that gets dragged out about everything concerning climate change. "It's not getting hotter, we were just in a cold period".
  - arrosenberg 5y ago
    The book Cadillac Desert makes that claim. When the water rights for the Colorado River were divided up, it was based on a quantity of water measured during a wetter year.
  - jeffbee 5y ago
    Yeah, but it's true. The period during which white settlers arrived in the American west was ridiculously wet. This presentation is a little irritating, but if you scroll about 80% of the way down you'll see the chart of tree ring data that shows tree growth was at a 1000-year exceptional peak during the 20th century. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2021/jun/17/tree-rings-america-megadrought-visual https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2021/jun/... Edit: Here's a more accessible version of the graph: https://science.sciencemag.org/content/368/6488/314/tab-figures-data https://science.sciencemag.org/content/368/6488/314/tab-figu...
    - gilbetron 5y ago
      "The only reason this drought is lagging behind that 1500s drought is because it's so young," Williams said. Both of your links show how bad the current drought is. If the current drought miraculously reverses itself in the next several years, than what you're arguing could be true. However, it doesn't look like that will be happening - time will tell.
      - jeffbee 5y ago
        Current drought is ridiculously bad, but is exacerbated by the ridiculously wet period that preceded it.
  - treis 5y ago
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colorado_River#/media/File:Coloradoflowgraph.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colorado_River#/media/File:Col... It's not exactly accurate because it doesn't account for water taken out for irrigation above this particular point, but it clearly shows the natural ebb and flow of the Colorado's volume.

by ssully 5y ago

arbitrary_name 5y ago

I was recently prompted to read 'Cadillac desert' which provides a very interesting summary of the development of water in the west, and the looming challenges. TLDR: it's gonna keep getting worse. Anyway, highly recommend.

treis 5y ago

As much as people like to ridicule the CC deniers for pointing to unusually cold conditions the same side loves to do it when it supports them. For the Colorado River specifically, we established "normal" during an atypically wet time and now that we've gone through actual normal to a dry cycle it's a crisis. It's the normal cyclical behavior of nature and not really Climate Change that's the issue.

gilbetron 5y ago
What are you talking about? Do you have some sources explaining this? This just seems like the oft-used, "previously it was an anomaly, we are returning to normal" pseudo-science that gets dragged out about everything concerning climate change. "It's not getting hotter, we were just in a cold period".
- arrosenberg 5y ago
  The book Cadillac Desert makes that claim. When the water rights for the Colorado River were divided up, it was based on a quantity of water measured during a wetter year.
- jeffbee 5y ago
  Yeah, but it's true. The period during which white settlers arrived in the American west was ridiculously wet. This presentation is a little irritating, but if you scroll about 80% of the way down you'll see the chart of tree ring data that shows tree growth was at a 1000-year exceptional peak during the 20th century. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2021/jun/17/tree-rings-america-megadrought-visual https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2021/jun/... Edit: Here's a more accessible version of the graph: https://science.sciencemag.org/content/368/6488/314/tab-figures-data https://science.sciencemag.org/content/368/6488/314/tab-figu...
  - gilbetron 5y ago
    "The only reason this drought is lagging behind that 1500s drought is because it's so young," Williams said. Both of your links show how bad the current drought is. If the current drought miraculously reverses itself in the next several years, than what you're arguing could be true. However, it doesn't look like that will be happening - time will tell.
    - jeffbee 5y ago
      Current drought is ridiculously bad, but is exacerbated by the ridiculously wet period that preceded it.
- treis 5y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colorado_River#/media/File:Coloradoflowgraph.png https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colorado_River#/media/File:Col... It's not exactly accurate because it doesn't account for water taken out for irrigation above this particular point, but it clearly shows the natural ebb and flow of the Colorado's volume.