4 ms·

Yet another misuse of the word "Bahasa" as if that's shorthand for "Indonesian". "Bahasa" literally just means "language", the Indonesian language doesn't have

Yet another misuse of the word "Bahasa" as if that's shorthand for "Indonesian". "Bahasa" literally just means "language", the Indonesian language doesn't have eponyms, so to say "He is Australian" you have to include the noun "person", so "Dia orang Australia" (Sound familiar? "orang utan" means "jungle person"). Same deal with language/bahasa. People saying "I speak Bahasa" sounds to me like people saying "I speak Sprache" to say they know German or "I speak langue" for French. It's eye-rollingly obnoxious.

ithkuil 5y ago
And don't forget Bahasa Malaysia
ta1234567890 5y ago
Interesting. It’s similar to the use of the word “chai” in the US. It originally means tea, but in the US it is used to mean a specific blend/preparation (usually masala), so they say “I’ll have a chai tea”, which literally means “I’ll have a tea tea”.
- grogenaut 5y ago
  carne asada grilled steak burrito for me
  - pksebben 5y ago
    To heavy for my taste, I'll have the ahi tuna.
- booleandilemma 5y ago
  See also: ATM machine, PIN number
  - NikolaNovak 5y ago
    "built on NT Technology" :)
- 8note 5y ago
  I thought masala meant spice mix? Spiced tea is a bit more specific than tea tea, but not much more
tombh 5y ago
Eye-rollingly obnoxious? I've literally heard native Indonesians refer to their language as just "bahasa", though admittedly those same speakers told me off for doing it myself. So whilst I agree "bahasa" has a commonly incorrect usage I don't think it is due to the typical "White Ignorance". I mean at least the author actually went to the effort of learning a non-European language right? It's like "literally" in English has _changed_ its meaning. Yeah of course it originally meant non-figuratively, but it is clear to all that value language as a medium of communication (rather than a measure of intellectual status) that it now has another meaning as an intensifier.
- DemocracyFTW 5y ago
  > I've literally heard native Indonesians refer to their language as just "bahasa", though admittedly those same speakers told me off for doing it myself The second part could be indicative of this being usage only acceptable for 'insiders' to employ, and the first part could mean but does not have to mean that outsiders / speakers of other languages / in other countries could and should use those very words. For example, in an American context one often hears "this country" to mean the USA, but that cannot be transported into contexts based outside the USA. Similarly, there's 우리나라 /uri nara/ lit. 'our country' > "Korea" in Korean but you wouldn't say "I'm flying to Urinara" or "I'm flying to Our Country" when you're about to board a plane to Seoul. In Japanese and Taiwan, the Japanese language and the Chinese language are often referred to as 國語 lit. 'national language' > "Japanese" or "Chinese" (depending on the language used). Of course you can't normally say "我不會講國語" in Chinese to mean "I don't speak Japanese" except when the context is clear and the listener can be expected that 國語 may mean Japanese in Japanese. So Indonesians using "bahasa" in Indonesian doesn't necessarily license using that word in English.
  - elefanten 5y ago
    This doesn’t make sense. If the word/phrase expresses a relative relationship to it’s user, then that works on a per user basis. Eg- Non-Americans can say “this country” about their own countries. If the word/phrase is a generic term in a given language, it often ends up having fixed context —- eg “la Raza” as used by Latin American communities. Besides, the original commenter denied it’s used at all. Gp implies otherwise. Broadly speaking, this whole business of trying to “own” words on an identity basis is poisonous, corrosive and an abuse of the tool of language.

ithkuil 5y ago

And don't forget Bahasa Malaysia

ta1234567890 5y ago

Interesting. It’s similar to the use of the word “chai” in the US. It originally means tea, but in the US it is used to mean a specific blend/preparation (usually masala), so they say “I’ll have a chai tea”, which literally means “I’ll have a tea tea”.

grogenaut 5y ago
carne asada grilled steak burrito for me
- pksebben 5y ago
  To heavy for my taste, I'll have the ahi tuna.
booleandilemma 5y ago
See also: ATM machine, PIN number
- NikolaNovak 5y ago
  "built on NT Technology" :)
8note 5y ago
I thought masala meant spice mix? Spiced tea is a bit more specific than tea tea, but not much more

tombh 5y ago

Eye-rollingly obnoxious? I've literally heard native Indonesians refer to their language as just "bahasa", though admittedly those same speakers told me off for doing it myself. So whilst I agree "bahasa" has a commonly incorrect usage I don't think it is due to the typical "White Ignorance". I mean at least the author actually went to the effort of learning a non-European language right? It's like "literally" in English has _changed_ its meaning. Yeah of course it originally meant non-figuratively, but it is clear to all that value language as a medium of communication (rather than a measure of intellectual status) that it now has another meaning as an intensifier.

DemocracyFTW 5y ago
> I've literally heard native Indonesians refer to their language as just "bahasa", though admittedly those same speakers told me off for doing it myself The second part could be indicative of this being usage only acceptable for 'insiders' to employ, and the first part could mean but does not have to mean that outsiders / speakers of other languages / in other countries could and should use those very words. For example, in an American context one often hears "this country" to mean the USA, but that cannot be transported into contexts based outside the USA. Similarly, there's 우리나라 /uri nara/ lit. 'our country' > "Korea" in Korean but you wouldn't say "I'm flying to Urinara" or "I'm flying to Our Country" when you're about to board a plane to Seoul. In Japanese and Taiwan, the Japanese language and the Chinese language are often referred to as 國語 lit. 'national language' > "Japanese" or "Chinese" (depending on the language used). Of course you can't normally say "我不會講國語" in Chinese to mean "I don't speak Japanese" except when the context is clear and the listener can be expected that 國語 may mean Japanese in Japanese. So Indonesians using "bahasa" in Indonesian doesn't necessarily license using that word in English.
- elefanten 5y ago
  This doesn’t make sense. If the word/phrase expresses a relative relationship to it’s user, then that works on a per user basis. Eg- Non-Americans can say “this country” about their own countries. If the word/phrase is a generic term in a given language, it often ends up having fixed context —- eg “la Raza” as used by Latin American communities. Besides, the original commenter denied it’s used at all. Gp implies otherwise. Broadly speaking, this whole business of trying to “own” words on an identity basis is poisonous, corrosive and an abuse of the tool of language.