5 ms·

Ivermectin is the new hydroxychloroquine, take 2

14 points by spzx 5y ago

The_rationalist 5y ago
Thymulin is the universal cure for immunodepressed induced mortality sensitivity, which indeed is the case for e.g the Covid. Basically the thymus progressively "deactivate itself" during ageing, thymalin a thymus hormone peptide reverse this degeneration/deactivation and increase lymphocite T production by 6.8X... It has been shown to reduce mortality rate by a factor of 2X for all_cause_mortality and annectodally, quite obviously given the lymphocite T increase has been shown to be effective as a cure against covid mortality. This drug and many other revolutionary old drugs that have seen previously longitudinal studies and multiple decent clinical trials with hundreds of patients will continue to be ignored by the world. This is a good reminder of how futuristic is the technology that has been discovered and how much we lag behind what has been discovered because there is far too much funding for researchers and not enough funding for meta-researchers AKA people that research the research in order to give it usefulness and awareness.
raffraffraff 5y ago
sciencebasedmedicine.org used to be one of my go-to places on the internet, along with the Cochrane library (which is more concerned with evidence based medicine). But they've shown themselves to be as dogmatic as they come: https://jessesingal.substack.com/p/how-science-based-medicine-botched https://jessesingal.substack.com/p/how-science-based-medicin... Such a pity. That is an explosive topic that needs to be examined carefully and honestly, but it is clear that Gorski and Novella are only interested in one narrative. And Novella is the author of one of the best works on critical thinking: https://www.thegreatcourses.com/courses/your-deceptive-mind-a-scientific-guide-to-critical-thinking-skills.html https://www.thegreatcourses.com/courses/your-deceptive-mind-... I'm not saying that the Ivermectin article isn't reliable, but Singal's piece is utterly devastating to their credibility.
- gus_massa 5y ago
  The artilce by Singal is about youth gender medicine, that is a field where you can't make double blind randomized controlled trials, like parachutes or open heat surgery. With Ivermectin and Hydroxychloroquine, it's very easy to make double blind randomized controlled trials.
  - raffraffraff 5y ago
    Isn't that the very reason why they should be careful not to endorse a particular treatment? The whole point of Singal's article is that they seem to have have decided in advance what they want to be true and are presenting and extremely one sided view of the available evidence to back up their choice. If anyone is wondering if they're making an honest mistake, this paragraph taken from their article, with the sources annotated by Singal, is the kicker: "Furthermore, the fact that young children may alter their identity as they mature is based on highly flawed research, studies with methods so fatally flawed that the results cannot be trusted, let alone cited as facts. [<-- this finding mostly comes from the Dutch clinic] But even if this statistic were reliable, it is less relevant to the discussion. As stated above, there are no medical interventions for this group of children. Medical gender-affirming interventions are reserved for adolescents and older. The data on adolescents is very different. While more data is certainly desired, the statistics we have indicate that nearly all adolescents who identify as trans maintain that identity into adulthood. [<-- this finding mostly comes from the Dutch clinic]" At best, Gorski & Novella should explain why they're calling this data fatally flawed when it disagrees with them but are happy to cite it when it doesn't. In the same paragraph, without highlighting this contradiction or explaining their own double standard
errantmind 5y ago
Meta Analysis: https://ivmmeta.com/ https://ivmmeta.com/
jstgord 5y ago
Each on its own merits, rather than conflate the two ? There does seem to be some strong evidence for Ivermectin, such as the recent Andrew Hill meta-analysis : https://academic.oup.com/ofid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/ofid/ofab358/6316214 https://academic.oup.com/ofid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/of... Science at the forefront is pretty noisy/messy, but places like Malaysia, Indonesia - where vaccine levels are modest and Delta exploding - dont have the luxury to wait till a totally clear picture emerges. I am perplexed that even in 'first world countries' authorities aren't distributing vitC + vitD + Zinc .. which seems of some benefit in strengthening natural immune response.
jstgord 5y ago
Interesting take, from one of the early RNA vaccine pioneers : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwbmJnacbgs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwbmJnacbgs

14 points by spzx 5y ago

Thymulin is the universal cure for immunodepressed induced mortality sensitivity, which indeed is the case for e.g the Covid. Basically the thymus progressively "deactivate itself" during ageing, thymalin a thymus hormone peptide reverse this degeneration/deactivation and increase lymphocite T production by 6.8X... It has been shown to reduce mortality rate by a factor of 2X for all_cause_mortality and annectodally, quite obviously given the lymphocite T increase has been shown to be effective as a cure against covid mortality. This drug and many other revolutionary old drugs that have seen previously longitudinal studies and multiple decent clinical trials with hundreds of patients will continue to be ignored by the world. This is a good reminder of how futuristic is the technology that has been discovered and how much we lag behind what has been discovered because there is far too much funding for researchers and not enough funding for meta-researchers AKA people that research the research in order to give it usefulness and awareness.

raffraffraff 5y ago

sciencebasedmedicine.org used to be one of my go-to places on the internet, along with the Cochrane library (which is more concerned with evidence based medicine). But they've shown themselves to be as dogmatic as they come: https://jessesingal.substack.com/p/how-science-based-medicine-botched https://jessesingal.substack.com/p/how-science-based-medicin... Such a pity. That is an explosive topic that needs to be examined carefully and honestly, but it is clear that Gorski and Novella are only interested in one narrative. And Novella is the author of one of the best works on critical thinking: https://www.thegreatcourses.com/courses/your-deceptive-mind-a-scientific-guide-to-critical-thinking-skills.html https://www.thegreatcourses.com/courses/your-deceptive-mind-... I'm not saying that the Ivermectin article isn't reliable, but Singal's piece is utterly devastating to their credibility.

gus_massa 5y ago
The artilce by Singal is about youth gender medicine, that is a field where you can't make double blind randomized controlled trials, like parachutes or open heat surgery. With Ivermectin and Hydroxychloroquine, it's very easy to make double blind randomized controlled trials.
- raffraffraff 5y ago
  Isn't that the very reason why they should be careful not to endorse a particular treatment? The whole point of Singal's article is that they seem to have have decided in advance what they want to be true and are presenting and extremely one sided view of the available evidence to back up their choice. If anyone is wondering if they're making an honest mistake, this paragraph taken from their article, with the sources annotated by Singal, is the kicker: "Furthermore, the fact that young children may alter their identity as they mature is based on highly flawed research, studies with methods so fatally flawed that the results cannot be trusted, let alone cited as facts. [<-- this finding mostly comes from the Dutch clinic] But even if this statistic were reliable, it is less relevant to the discussion. As stated above, there are no medical interventions for this group of children. Medical gender-affirming interventions are reserved for adolescents and older. The data on adolescents is very different. While more data is certainly desired, the statistics we have indicate that nearly all adolescents who identify as trans maintain that identity into adulthood. [<-- this finding mostly comes from the Dutch clinic]" At best, Gorski & Novella should explain why they're calling this data fatally flawed when it disagrees with them but are happy to cite it when it doesn't. In the same paragraph, without highlighting this contradiction or explaining their own double standard

errantmind 5y ago

Meta Analysis: https://ivmmeta.com/ https://ivmmeta.com/

jstgord 5y ago

Each on its own merits, rather than conflate the two ? There does seem to be some strong evidence for Ivermectin, such as the recent Andrew Hill meta-analysis : https://academic.oup.com/ofid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/ofid/ofab358/6316214 https://academic.oup.com/ofid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/of... Science at the forefront is pretty noisy/messy, but places like Malaysia, Indonesia - where vaccine levels are modest and Delta exploding - dont have the luxury to wait till a totally clear picture emerges. I am perplexed that even in 'first world countries' authorities aren't distributing vitC + vitD + Zinc .. which seems of some benefit in strengthening natural immune response.

jstgord 5y ago

Interesting take, from one of the early RNA vaccine pioneers : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwbmJnacbgs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZwbmJnacbgs