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I don't really see what Elon actually does beyond cultivating public image and having money.

by _tulpa 5y ago

jamiek88 5y ago
Let’s not go too far the other way now. He’s chief engineer at spacex for starters.
- delecti 5y ago
  Edit: I can admit when I'm wrong. I stand by my assertion that it's absurd to call him a founder of Tesla, but his position in SpaceX seems to be legit. ~~He may be credited as chief engineer at SpaceX, but that doesn't mean he's meaningfully contributing to actual engineering efforts.~~ He's also credited as a founder of Tesla, despite not actually being involved in the founding of that company.
  - kiba 5y ago
    Elon Musk is a real engineer, especially if other engineers said he's an engineer.[1] Whatever his history is with other people or whatever his personality flaws or weakness, he's the real deal. [1]: https://www.reddit.com/r/SpaceXLounge/comments/k1e0ta/evidence_that_musk_is_the_chief_engineer_of_spacex/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SpaceXLounge/comments/k1e0ta/eviden...
    - Dah00n 5y ago
      >if other engineers said he's an engineer Nonsense! Engineer is an education, not a job title. It's no different than Musk calling himself Doctor. He either went to school for years to become an engineer or he isn't one.
      - emptysongglass 5y ago
        I'm a software engineer. I do software engineering with other software engineers. But I didn't go to school for it, I was self-taught. That doesn't make me less of an engineer. It's ok to express an opinion about Musk either way. You can not like him for all kinds of reasons. But he actually wrote video games as a kid growing up. He wrote code at his earliest startups and a lot of it.
        TheRealNGenius 5y ago
        It kinda does, not because you were self trained, but because it is software engineering. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_and_licensure_in_engineering#Title_usage https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_and_licensure_in_en...
        Tabular-Iceberg 5y ago
        I know the word gets thrown around a lot, but “software engineering” doesn’t really have anything to do with engineering at all, and it certainly doesn’t make anyone engineers. Not just because it doesn’t have any formal recognition as an engineering discipline but more importantly because the field is too immature for any such recognition to be at all meaningful. Case in point, all those private certification schemes and how lousy predictors they are of project success.
        TheRealNGenius 5y ago
        this is correct, it shouldn't be called engineering at all actually.
        Dah00n 5y ago
        >I'm a software engineer. You know as well as I do that when talking about building a submarine (and linking to SpaceX discussions) "Engineer" isn't meant as someone who made a video game back in the day. It has zero percentage to do with code. With that said I'm also sure you know that Software Engineer isn't seen as a "real engineer" (and I'm in the same camp as you FYI). It is more like Medical Technician versus Doctor. In most countries you need a license besides an education to b a "real engineer" and Software Engineers cannot get one. The whole job title is a misnomer, just like Engineer in American English has become it seems, though some Board of Examiners still sue you if you try to call yourself an Engineer without a license[0]. I did not write a single word that was positive or negative about Elon Musk in the comment. [0]https://eu.starnewsonline.com/story/news/2021/06/10/former-wilmington-engineer-sues-first-amendment-rights-lawsuit/7626559002/ https://eu.starnewsonline.com/story/news/2021/06/10/former-w...
      - iso1210 5y ago
        The term Engineer is pretty much meaningless in the US. The IT trade is pathetic in this area -- if you swap out a few cat5s you're suddenly an "Network Engineer". Cut and paste some stackoverflow snippets together and you're a "Software Engineer". In the UK the term is meaningless too, but CEng isn't. You don't become a Chartered Engineer until you've done the education but also have monitored professional practice experience.
        hef19898 5y ago
        The bare minimum is to have bachelor's degree in engineering, no matter what engineering field. You have that, you are an engineer, you don't you'rr not. Regardless of the career you choose after graduation.
  - AussieWog93 5y ago
    Even if he doesn't do the hands-on design work himself, he's clearly good at both recognising engineering talent and evaluating information that's presented to him. You couldn't have either of these skills without some engineering knowledge.
    - Dah00n 5y ago
      Sure, but having engineering knowledge doesn't make you an engineer just like having medical knowledge doesn't make you a doctor.
    - andi999 5y ago
      So when will his engineers tell him that hyperloop won't work (assuming he honestly doesn't know).
      - _hyn3 5y ago
        Why won't it? It's just scaling up bank air tubes. But that's almost irrelevant to my larger point: Where would we be right now if [pick any inventor] had listened when the experts said, "it won't work"? An inventor's job is to have a big imagination. A successful inventor usually has enough of an engineering background to test their hypothesis and refine as needed. Most of them also know how to gather highly educated minds to help them. Many successful inventors do not have deep academic backgrounds, because often those educational backgrounds tell them only what is impossible, not what is possible.
    - delecti 5y ago
      I edited my comment a while ago, I'm not sure your reply is really relevant to the updated version. But what you described is just being a CTO. That's an important job, but is still separate from being chief engineer.
      - _hyn3 5y ago
        “He’s obviously skilled at all those different functions, but certainly what really drives him and where his passion really is, is his role as CTO,” or chief technology officer, Reisman said. “Basically his role as chief designer and chief engineer. That’s the part of the job that really plays to his strengths." From that Reddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/SpaceXLounge/comments/k1e0ta/evidence_that_musk_is_the_chief_engineer_of_spacex/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SpaceXLounge/comments/k1e0ta/eviden...
- heavyset_go 5y ago
  He's also the Technoking of Tesla. The titles don't mean much when he can make them up and give them to himself whenever he feels like it.
- na85 5y ago
  >He’s chief engineer at spacex for starters. He calls himself that, sure. Elon is a smart guy, and that's why I think he positions himself the way he does. He doesn't want to be Bill Gates, he wants to be perceived as a man of the people. A dudebro who happens to be rich. That's why he's smoking joints with Joe Rogan on camera and tweeting about WSB. There is zero percent chance that Elon is actually doing any technical analysis or design for SpaceX. He calls himself Chief Engineer for the same reason Trump claims to be a master-level deal maker. They're narcissists cultivating their respective cults of personality, and the legions of sycophants just lap this stuff up.
  - kiba 5y ago
    This is 100% public perception that he's a business development guy and all, because all we see is him tweeting, memeing, and sometime making a fool of himself. He's an engineer, and there's a bunch of engineers who worked with him who will attest to that.
    - Dah00n 5y ago
      Why do you need someone who worked with him to attast it? Engineer is something you go to school to become, not something you become because you have money or workers. Either he have an education as an engineer or he isn't an engineer. Giving yourself a title in your own company doesn't make it so.
      - fastball 5y ago
        You definitely don't need formal education in order to be an engineer.
      - iso1210 5y ago
        In many countries, Engineer is a protected status job title. In the US I believe "Professional Engineer" is protected In the US, going to school to become a Graduate Engineer does not make you a Professional Engineer.
    - na85 5y ago
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

I don't really see what Elon actually does beyond cultivating public image and having money.

by _tulpa 5y ago

I don't really see what Elon actually does beyond cultivating public image and having money.

jamiek88 5y ago

Let’s not go too far the other way now. He’s chief engineer at spacex for starters.

delecti 5y ago
Edit: I can admit when I'm wrong. I stand by my assertion that it's absurd to call him a founder of Tesla, but his position in SpaceX seems to be legit. ~~He may be credited as chief engineer at SpaceX, but that doesn't mean he's meaningfully contributing to actual engineering efforts.~~ He's also credited as a founder of Tesla, despite not actually being involved in the founding of that company.
- kiba 5y ago
  Elon Musk is a real engineer, especially if other engineers said he's an engineer.[1] Whatever his history is with other people or whatever his personality flaws or weakness, he's the real deal. [1]: https://www.reddit.com/r/SpaceXLounge/comments/k1e0ta/evidence_that_musk_is_the_chief_engineer_of_spacex/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SpaceXLounge/comments/k1e0ta/eviden...
  - Dah00n 5y ago
    >if other engineers said he's an engineer Nonsense! Engineer is an education, not a job title. It's no different than Musk calling himself Doctor. He either went to school for years to become an engineer or he isn't one.
    - emptysongglass 5y ago
      I'm a software engineer. I do software engineering with other software engineers. But I didn't go to school for it, I was self-taught. That doesn't make me less of an engineer. It's ok to express an opinion about Musk either way. You can not like him for all kinds of reasons. But he actually wrote video games as a kid growing up. He wrote code at his earliest startups and a lot of it.
      - TheRealNGenius 5y ago
        It kinda does, not because you were self trained, but because it is software engineering. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_and_licensure_in_engineering#Title_usage https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_and_licensure_in_en...
      - Tabular-Iceberg 5y ago
        I know the word gets thrown around a lot, but “software engineering” doesn’t really have anything to do with engineering at all, and it certainly doesn’t make anyone engineers. Not just because it doesn’t have any formal recognition as an engineering discipline but more importantly because the field is too immature for any such recognition to be at all meaningful. Case in point, all those private certification schemes and how lousy predictors they are of project success.
        TheRealNGenius 5y ago
        this is correct, it shouldn't be called engineering at all actually.
      - Dah00n 5y ago
        >I'm a software engineer. You know as well as I do that when talking about building a submarine (and linking to SpaceX discussions) "Engineer" isn't meant as someone who made a video game back in the day. It has zero percentage to do with code. With that said I'm also sure you know that Software Engineer isn't seen as a "real engineer" (and I'm in the same camp as you FYI). It is more like Medical Technician versus Doctor. In most countries you need a license besides an education to b a "real engineer" and Software Engineers cannot get one. The whole job title is a misnomer, just like Engineer in American English has become it seems, though some Board of Examiners still sue you if you try to call yourself an Engineer without a license[0]. I did not write a single word that was positive or negative about Elon Musk in the comment. [0]https://eu.starnewsonline.com/story/news/2021/06/10/former-wilmington-engineer-sues-first-amendment-rights-lawsuit/7626559002/ https://eu.starnewsonline.com/story/news/2021/06/10/former-w...
    - iso1210 5y ago
      The term Engineer is pretty much meaningless in the US. The IT trade is pathetic in this area -- if you swap out a few cat5s you're suddenly an "Network Engineer". Cut and paste some stackoverflow snippets together and you're a "Software Engineer". In the UK the term is meaningless too, but CEng isn't. You don't become a Chartered Engineer until you've done the education but also have monitored professional practice experience.
      - hef19898 5y ago
        The bare minimum is to have bachelor's degree in engineering, no matter what engineering field. You have that, you are an engineer, you don't you'rr not. Regardless of the career you choose after graduation.
- AussieWog93 5y ago
  Even if he doesn't do the hands-on design work himself, he's clearly good at both recognising engineering talent and evaluating information that's presented to him. You couldn't have either of these skills without some engineering knowledge.
  - Dah00n 5y ago
    Sure, but having engineering knowledge doesn't make you an engineer just like having medical knowledge doesn't make you a doctor.
  - andi999 5y ago
    So when will his engineers tell him that hyperloop won't work (assuming he honestly doesn't know).
    - _hyn3 5y ago
      Why won't it? It's just scaling up bank air tubes. But that's almost irrelevant to my larger point: Where would we be right now if [pick any inventor] had listened when the experts said, "it won't work"? An inventor's job is to have a big imagination. A successful inventor usually has enough of an engineering background to test their hypothesis and refine as needed. Most of them also know how to gather highly educated minds to help them. Many successful inventors do not have deep academic backgrounds, because often those educational backgrounds tell them only what is impossible, not what is possible.
  - delecti 5y ago
    I edited my comment a while ago, I'm not sure your reply is really relevant to the updated version. But what you described is just being a CTO. That's an important job, but is still separate from being chief engineer.
    - _hyn3 5y ago
      “He’s obviously skilled at all those different functions, but certainly what really drives him and where his passion really is, is his role as CTO,” or chief technology officer, Reisman said. “Basically his role as chief designer and chief engineer. That’s the part of the job that really plays to his strengths." From that Reddit thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/SpaceXLounge/comments/k1e0ta/evidence_that_musk_is_the_chief_engineer_of_spacex/ https://www.reddit.com/r/SpaceXLounge/comments/k1e0ta/eviden...
heavyset_go 5y ago
He's also the Technoking of Tesla. The titles don't mean much when he can make them up and give them to himself whenever he feels like it.
na85 5y ago
>He’s chief engineer at spacex for starters. He calls himself that, sure. Elon is a smart guy, and that's why I think he positions himself the way he does. He doesn't want to be Bill Gates, he wants to be perceived as a man of the people. A dudebro who happens to be rich. That's why he's smoking joints with Joe Rogan on camera and tweeting about WSB. There is zero percent chance that Elon is actually doing any technical analysis or design for SpaceX. He calls himself Chief Engineer for the same reason Trump claims to be a master-level deal maker. They're narcissists cultivating their respective cults of personality, and the legions of sycophants just lap this stuff up.
- kiba 5y ago
  This is 100% public perception that he's a business development guy and all, because all we see is him tweeting, memeing, and sometime making a fool of himself. He's an engineer, and there's a bunch of engineers who worked with him who will attest to that.
  - Dah00n 5y ago
    Why do you need someone who worked with him to attast it? Engineer is something you go to school to become, not something you become because you have money or workers. Either he have an education as an engineer or he isn't an engineer. Giving yourself a title in your own company doesn't make it so.
    - fastball 5y ago
      You definitely don't need formal education in order to be an engineer.
    - iso1210 5y ago
      In many countries, Engineer is a protected status job title. In the US I believe "Professional Engineer" is protected In the US, going to school to become a Graduate Engineer does not make you a Professional Engineer.
  - na85 5y ago
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]