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Even the best case scenarios for the future are looking increasingly grim. Some people might not want to bring a child into a dystopian nightmare.

ianai 5y ago
This seems closer to reality for me. If society wants kids it needs to step up and feel more like a culture people want to contribute into the future. Instead, having a kid sounds like spinning a life off into a lot of harsh circumstances. That kids going to need to sustain itself someday and society’s clearly trying to automate humans out of any and every productive work.
jollybean 5y ago
I really can't fathom these kinds of arguments at all. Do you (did you?) have a relationship with your grandparents? Because if you just listen to their stories you might see how good you have it. It doesn't matter where they are from the probably had it rough and they probably don't even talk like they had it rough. Literally in just 2 generations the world has been immensely better on almost every front. Two full generations ago, most rural people didn't have plumbing. They just got electricity. About 6% went to University. There was no 'Social Security/Insurance'. There was no government supported healthcare. Racism was 'institutional' i.e. 'We don't serve your kind'. Many of my friends relatives died in terrible situations during wars. Almost all Europeans have civilization trauma just two generations ago. Just 3 generations ago, my ancestors were both disowned for marrying one another (Protestant v. Catholic). Infant mortality was 10% in 1900. There were no antibiotics (!) literally cutting yourself with a knife could mean amputation (from infection) and people died of all sorts of things. A whole ton of men died building the Hoover dam. Union workers were shot. Edit: and most people couldn't even vote! Now, the major thing we have to worry about is climate change, and I have no doubt wel'l eventually move past it even while it's a little bit disruptive, it's not going to be existential for most people. There are fewer wars than ever in history, it's too expensive to fight now. Unless you live in China, where the CCP wants to put 100 cameras on you all day ever day, I can't even understand what kinds of people are so existentially cynical. Because I believe it is objectively (mostly) true that life is immensely better and mostly improving ... I'm almost inclined to believe those with views of ultra dystopia might have a version of depression of some kind. We probably need to work on this 'child' issue a big with a multi-pronged approach. Quebec (Canada) instituted 'cheap daycare' (it's fairly socialized) and it actually had an effect. The US of course is not into having consistent healthcare for all citizens, so that might be a stretch in that country.
- dupe5766 5y ago
  What scares me is China is making moves and just seems to do everything right while the US stays paralyzed and stumbles across every obstacle. It seems inevitable China will be calling the shots soon. A scary dystopian dystopian regime will be mandating world affairs. And things are not all rosy here either. I think its naive to say things are better on every front. The middle class has been shrinking over the last couple decades in the US.

ianai 5y ago

This seems closer to reality for me. If society wants kids it needs to step up and feel more like a culture people want to contribute into the future. Instead, having a kid sounds like spinning a life off into a lot of harsh circumstances. That kids going to need to sustain itself someday and society’s clearly trying to automate humans out of any and every productive work.

jollybean 5y ago

I really can't fathom these kinds of arguments at all. Do you (did you?) have a relationship with your grandparents? Because if you just listen to their stories you might see how good you have it. It doesn't matter where they are from the probably had it rough and they probably don't even talk like they had it rough. Literally in just 2 generations the world has been immensely better on almost every front. Two full generations ago, most rural people didn't have plumbing. They just got electricity. About 6% went to University. There was no 'Social Security/Insurance'. There was no government supported healthcare. Racism was 'institutional' i.e. 'We don't serve your kind'. Many of my friends relatives died in terrible situations during wars. Almost all Europeans have civilization trauma just two generations ago. Just 3 generations ago, my ancestors were both disowned for marrying one another (Protestant v. Catholic). Infant mortality was 10% in 1900. There were no antibiotics (!) literally cutting yourself with a knife could mean amputation (from infection) and people died of all sorts of things. A whole ton of men died building the Hoover dam. Union workers were shot. Edit: and most people couldn't even vote! Now, the major thing we have to worry about is climate change, and I have no doubt wel'l eventually move past it even while it's a little bit disruptive, it's not going to be existential for most people. There are fewer wars than ever in history, it's too expensive to fight now. Unless you live in China, where the CCP wants to put 100 cameras on you all day ever day, I can't even understand what kinds of people are so existentially cynical. Because I believe it is objectively (mostly) true that life is immensely better and mostly improving ... I'm almost inclined to believe those with views of ultra dystopia might have a version of depression of some kind. We probably need to work on this 'child' issue a big with a multi-pronged approach. Quebec (Canada) instituted 'cheap daycare' (it's fairly socialized) and it actually had an effect. The US of course is not into having consistent healthcare for all citizens, so that might be a stretch in that country.

dupe5766 5y ago
What scares me is China is making moves and just seems to do everything right while the US stays paralyzed and stumbles across every obstacle. It seems inevitable China will be calling the shots soon. A scary dystopian dystopian regime will be mandating world affairs. And things are not all rosy here either. I think its naive to say things are better on every front. The middle class has been shrinking over the last couple decades in the US.