4 ms·

Is there a list somewhere of apps that use placer so that I can delete those apps off my phone forever?

gregsadetsky 5y ago
There was a flagged submission about a year ago about them https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22704138 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22704138 I’ll go on a limb and say that apps don’t even have to integrate Placer’s sdk directly. If an app uses any monetization/tracking/ad tracking system, that tracking vendor may collect the geo data and then re-sell it to Placer (i.e. talk to Placer via a server to server API to let them know about the end user)
- tolbish 5y ago
  How much geo data can they obtain if my location is disabled for almost all of my apps?
  - gregsadetsky 5y ago
    1) A device's location can be guessed with your IP address at the very least. 2) Wifi networks. On iOS, I'm almost sure that apps cannot access the list of wifi networks that the device sees. As you may know, the list of wifi access point MAC addresses can be used to triangulate a device's geolocation (there was a related case with Google Streets View cars gobbling up that info[0]) On Android, wifi network MAC addresses may be available to apps? Is there a special permission that apps need from the user? [0] https://www.wired.com/2012/05/google-wifi-fcc-investigation/ https://www.wired.com/2012/05/google-wifi-fcc-investigation/
    - kevinventullo 5y ago
      Android requires location services enabled to do ambient WiFi scans: https://developer.android.com/guide/topics/connectivity/wifi-scan https://developer.android.com/guide/topics/connectivity/wifi... However, I believe connected WiFi information can be obtained on Android without location services enabled. On iOS, I believe an app needs special permission even to fetch connected WiFi, and I believe you are correct that there is no way to access ambient WiFi scans.
      - gregsadetsky 5y ago
        Super interesting, thanks!
      - cmeacham98 5y ago
        > However, I believe connected WiFi information can be obtained on Android without location services enabled. Correct, you need the "Access network state" permission (renamed to a more sensible "View network connections" in more recent versions of Android). However, to my knowledge neither the play store or Android system warn/ask you about this permission so to avoid it you have to explicitly check every app you install.
        tolbish 5y ago
        I believe the function is "Wi-Fi scanning" in the networking settings tab on Android 11.
  - alam2000 5y ago
    There are several devices or information can be used to deduce your location. a) IP address b) WIFI MAC address c) Mobile telco tower ID d) GPS coordinates
xriddle 5y ago
Placer is one of many, many platforms that do this. Assume any app that requests location permissions is selling your data. Hopefully anonymized.
- nebula8804 5y ago
  A few months ago I chose a random set of iOS apps to decompile and view their included libraries. Its amazing how much tracking is going on. One interesting that I recall was a Bluetooth library in a convenience store app. Seems like they had Bluetooth beacons around there store and it would use the phone to track you as you walked through the store.
  - hhh 5y ago
    Doesn't Walmart do this?
  - deadbolt 5y ago
    I recall the CVS app requesting Bluetooth permissions when I installed it. I can imagine them implementing something like this, but couldn't they just passively listen for Bluetooth beacons from people's phones using the devices in the store, without needing the app to be installed on a customers phone? I suppose I'm not familiar enough with Bluetooth - I figured phones with Bluetooth enabled are constantly sending out some kind of "hello" beacon.
    - HeyLaughingBoy 5y ago
      The beacons in the store are pretty dumb, so they can be cheap (on the order of a few dollars each) and plentiful, moving the real logic of tracking to the app. You're correct in that it could be reversed and the BLE radios in the store could track the phones instead, but then they'd need far more intelligence and network connectivity, which would make them more expensive and in turn they'd be fewer of them deployed. Source: spent the last few years writing code for wireless devices, including BLE beacons.
nomel 5y ago
If you're on iOS, leave location services to "while using app" to prevent this. I take the extra step of turning background services off.

There was a flagged submission about a year ago about them https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22704138 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=22704138 I’ll go on a limb and say that apps don’t even have to integrate Placer’s sdk directly. If an app uses any monetization/tracking/ad tracking system, that tracking vendor may collect the geo data and then re-sell it to Placer (i.e. talk to Placer via a server to server API to let them know about the end user)

tolbish 5y ago
How much geo data can they obtain if my location is disabled for almost all of my apps?
- gregsadetsky 5y ago
  1) A device's location can be guessed with your IP address at the very least. 2) Wifi networks. On iOS, I'm almost sure that apps cannot access the list of wifi networks that the device sees. As you may know, the list of wifi access point MAC addresses can be used to triangulate a device's geolocation (there was a related case with Google Streets View cars gobbling up that info[0]) On Android, wifi network MAC addresses may be available to apps? Is there a special permission that apps need from the user? [0] https://www.wired.com/2012/05/google-wifi-fcc-investigation/ https://www.wired.com/2012/05/google-wifi-fcc-investigation/
  - kevinventullo 5y ago
    Android requires location services enabled to do ambient WiFi scans: https://developer.android.com/guide/topics/connectivity/wifi-scan https://developer.android.com/guide/topics/connectivity/wifi... However, I believe connected WiFi information can be obtained on Android without location services enabled. On iOS, I believe an app needs special permission even to fetch connected WiFi, and I believe you are correct that there is no way to access ambient WiFi scans.
    - gregsadetsky 5y ago
      Super interesting, thanks!
    - cmeacham98 5y ago
      > However, I believe connected WiFi information can be obtained on Android without location services enabled. Correct, you need the "Access network state" permission (renamed to a more sensible "View network connections" in more recent versions of Android). However, to my knowledge neither the play store or Android system warn/ask you about this permission so to avoid it you have to explicitly check every app you install.
      - tolbish 5y ago
        I believe the function is "Wi-Fi scanning" in the networking settings tab on Android 11.
- alam2000 5y ago
  There are several devices or information can be used to deduce your location. a) IP address b) WIFI MAC address c) Mobile telco tower ID d) GPS coordinates

xriddle 5y ago

Placer is one of many, many platforms that do this. Assume any app that requests location permissions is selling your data. Hopefully anonymized.

nebula8804 5y ago
A few months ago I chose a random set of iOS apps to decompile and view their included libraries. Its amazing how much tracking is going on. One interesting that I recall was a Bluetooth library in a convenience store app. Seems like they had Bluetooth beacons around there store and it would use the phone to track you as you walked through the store.
- hhh 5y ago
  Doesn't Walmart do this?
- deadbolt 5y ago
  I recall the CVS app requesting Bluetooth permissions when I installed it. I can imagine them implementing something like this, but couldn't they just passively listen for Bluetooth beacons from people's phones using the devices in the store, without needing the app to be installed on a customers phone? I suppose I'm not familiar enough with Bluetooth - I figured phones with Bluetooth enabled are constantly sending out some kind of "hello" beacon.
  - HeyLaughingBoy 5y ago
    The beacons in the store are pretty dumb, so they can be cheap (on the order of a few dollars each) and plentiful, moving the real logic of tracking to the app. You're correct in that it could be reversed and the BLE radios in the store could track the phones instead, but then they'd need far more intelligence and network connectivity, which would make them more expensive and in turn they'd be fewer of them deployed. Source: spent the last few years writing code for wireless devices, including BLE beacons.

nomel 5y ago

If you're on iOS, leave location services to "while using app" to prevent this. I take the extra step of turning background services off.