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IMO Most of the major incidents involving self driving failures are actually simply failures of scene construction and not ones of AI. So while self driving mi

IMO Most of the major incidents involving self driving failures are actually simply failures of scene construction and not ones of AI. So while self driving might be hard (as in Hard AI) the notable failure are actually in the "easier" parts. Examples from memory (that may be faulty and not specific to a company): Car hits cyclist crossing street. Car runs into stationary vehicles Car turns into semitruck

acoard 5y ago
>simply failures of scene construction Isn't "scene construction" part of AI? From a technical angle: computer vision and object recognition are AI. From a philosophical angle: part of human conscientiousness, and intelligence, is to exist in a spatiotemporal frame. This is one of Kant's points[0]. Our intelligence constructs scenes from our sensory input, but we have things like object permanence which have a deeper understanding than simply what our senses show. [0] https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/kant-spacetime/ https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/kant-spacetime/
- petermcneeley 5y ago
  I Kant argue with that. But you would at least agree that basic 3d modeling of your world is at a lower level of difficulty than say understanding the intention of drivers or someone giving directions?
kaba0 5y ago
So the “simple” failures are due to the very hard problem of reconstructing a “mental” model from multiple 2D images, and actually attributing different properties to objects recognized? Like you don’t have to stop at a plastic bag? People learn these things for a long time and we actually have a proper model of the world for exactly that reason.
- petermcneeley 5y ago
  Yes but the notable incidents are not "car stopped for plastic bag" The incidents that I have described would actually be resolved by 3d scanning technology (not saying that thats the correct approach either)
  - kaba0 5y ago
    No they wouldn’t be solved. And there was actually an incident like that with a plastic bag.
    - petermcneeley 5y ago
      Link or it didnt happen ;)

acoard 5y ago

>simply failures of scene construction Isn't "scene construction" part of AI? From a technical angle: computer vision and object recognition are AI. From a philosophical angle: part of human conscientiousness, and intelligence, is to exist in a spatiotemporal frame. This is one of Kant's points[0]. Our intelligence constructs scenes from our sensory input, but we have things like object permanence which have a deeper understanding than simply what our senses show. [0] https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/kant-spacetime/ https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/kant-spacetime/

petermcneeley 5y ago
I Kant argue with that. But you would at least agree that basic 3d modeling of your world is at a lower level of difficulty than say understanding the intention of drivers or someone giving directions?

kaba0 5y ago

So the “simple” failures are due to the very hard problem of reconstructing a “mental” model from multiple 2D images, and actually attributing different properties to objects recognized? Like you don’t have to stop at a plastic bag? People learn these things for a long time and we actually have a proper model of the world for exactly that reason.

petermcneeley 5y ago
Yes but the notable incidents are not "car stopped for plastic bag" The incidents that I have described would actually be resolved by 3d scanning technology (not saying that thats the correct approach either)
- kaba0 5y ago
  No they wouldn’t be solved. And there was actually an incident like that with a plastic bag.
  - petermcneeley 5y ago
    Link or it didnt happen ;)