4 ms·

The Windows 11 insider build is surprisingly unpolished and unfinished

20 points by airstrike 5y ago

SirPrize 5y ago
> is surprisingly unpolished and unfinished > Of course, this isn't a surprise Wait, so isn't this what we'd expect from an alpha release? Interesting article but the headline seems misleading. Can others compare the severity of these bugs to other insider builds?
- aarongolliver 5y ago
  much worse than regular win 10 insider builds, not much worse than the other previews for unreleased windows versions. Except for a few bugs in the settings menu which I've figured out ways to work around (couldn't switch easily between stereo and 5.1) I pretty much don't notices the differences between 10 and 11
rvz 5y ago
No shit early adopter. It's CALLED an 'insider build'... It's for developers. Smart people who are not developers know to wait for the released version / golden master, or slowly try out the release version before going all in. What a SUrpRIsE! /s
- anthk 5y ago
  I've seen more stable behaviour on the -current/rolling releases of Unixen that this.
phendrenad2 5y ago
> Jim Salter It didn't take long to find our first Windows 11 bug—the DNS resolver stack was weirdly broken. Nslookup works, but ping doesn't! I mean, that isn't exactly common usage, so I wonder why they tried that so quickly?
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
  It's pretty basic troubleshooting if you can't reach a network resource like a website or a file share. What do you do in those scenarios?
  - lowlevel 5y ago
    Rollback the wifi driver update of course.
walterlb 5y ago
The picture at the top of the article has the caption "Setting Windows 11 to one of its dark themes also darkens the background of the Settings app—but not the background of most traditional apps, like Resource Monitor". This doesn't seem like news.. Dark theme has been in Win 10 for a while and didn't apply to old style apps. Did they specifically promise to do this?
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
  Which is hilarious when you consider that those "old-style" applications had a lot finer-grained control over their theming in Windows95-XP. Just another example of software developers doing what they do best these days: reinventing the wheel, but worse.
  - gruez 5y ago
    https://blog.codinghorror.com/a-tribute-to-the-windows-31-hot-dog-stand-color-scheme/ https://blog.codinghorror.com/a-tribute-to-the-windows-31-ho... It's strange how "dark/light mode" was such an innovative/killer feature, when the same feature was available decades ago.
    - xg15 5y ago
      Like iOS gaining the revolutionary feature of displaying up to two(!) apps side-by-side simultaneously. I also noticed that received Windows versions don't even have the option of changing the system font anymore. Even changing the font size is only possible in a tightly restricted range and is framed as an accessibility feature, not a customisation. Sometimes it feels like customisation is removed so you can have more things available that can be announced (or sold) as "features"...
- whywhywhywhy 5y ago
  End of the day the UI framework choices of the past on Windows has made a consistent UI an impossibility. Too many parts of it from a different era that they can’t really update the UI for all seemingly built with slightly different tooling. If there was someone with the vision to truly drag this OS forward they would be aiming to rewrite at least a handful of these tools to modern tech consistently each release. Of course many users will scream because things are changing but honestly if they want to move forward they have to ignore them. And by forward I mean forwards to being the best desktop OS. OSX currently holds that crown because they were willing to throw everything out. OSX likely won’t exist anymore in 5-10 years the way Apple is heading so Microsoft actually has a chance here if they get serious.
2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago
Its on the "dev ring" of the insider build reserved for the jankiest WIP builds and they even warn you when using it. We just love to hate Microsoft so much that we attack unfinished software for being unfinished.
- simonblack 5y ago
  We just love to hate Microsoft so much that we attack unfinished software for being unfinished. Conditioned response. <grin> We're so conditioned to Microsoft's "finished" software being unfinished, that this seems 'normal' procedure.
rkagerer 5y ago
You can't perform a nice, clean Windows 11 installation yet, sadly—you'll need to use Windows Update to mangle an existing Windows 10 installation instead. This says it all, really. My impression is this is just the latest patches with some fresh lipstick painted on. Would be pleased to be proven wrong.
- passivate 5y ago
  Personally, I don't care how the features are delivered - OS re-install, OS upgrade, small patch update, or w/e. I'm interested in the TPM2 derived features. Don't care much for the usual UI fluff in newer versions.
rthomas6 5y ago
That's because every other Windows build is crap, more or less. Then it gets fixed up in the next iteration. Windows 3.1: Good Windows 95: Crap Windows 98: Good Windows 2000: Good Windows ME: Crap Windows XP: Good Windows Vista: Crap Windows 7: Good Windows 8: Crap Windows 10: Good Windows 11: ?

20 points by airstrike 5y ago

> is surprisingly unpolished and unfinished > Of course, this isn't a surprise Wait, so isn't this what we'd expect from an alpha release? Interesting article but the headline seems misleading. Can others compare the severity of these bugs to other insider builds?

aarongolliver 5y ago
much worse than regular win 10 insider builds, not much worse than the other previews for unreleased windows versions. Except for a few bugs in the settings menu which I've figured out ways to work around (couldn't switch easily between stereo and 5.1) I pretty much don't notices the differences between 10 and 11

rvz 5y ago

No shit early adopter. It's CALLED an 'insider build'... It's for developers. Smart people who are not developers know to wait for the released version / golden master, or slowly try out the release version before going all in. What a SUrpRIsE! /s

anthk 5y ago
I've seen more stable behaviour on the -current/rolling releases of Unixen that this.

phendrenad2 5y ago

> Jim Salter It didn't take long to find our first Windows 11 bug—the DNS resolver stack was weirdly broken. Nslookup works, but ping doesn't! I mean, that isn't exactly common usage, so I wonder why they tried that so quickly?

AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
It's pretty basic troubleshooting if you can't reach a network resource like a website or a file share. What do you do in those scenarios?
- lowlevel 5y ago
  Rollback the wifi driver update of course.

walterlb 5y ago

The picture at the top of the article has the caption "Setting Windows 11 to one of its dark themes also darkens the background of the Settings app—but not the background of most traditional apps, like Resource Monitor". This doesn't seem like news.. Dark theme has been in Win 10 for a while and didn't apply to old style apps. Did they specifically promise to do this?

AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
Which is hilarious when you consider that those "old-style" applications had a lot finer-grained control over their theming in Windows95-XP. Just another example of software developers doing what they do best these days: reinventing the wheel, but worse.
- gruez 5y ago
  https://blog.codinghorror.com/a-tribute-to-the-windows-31-hot-dog-stand-color-scheme/ https://blog.codinghorror.com/a-tribute-to-the-windows-31-ho... It's strange how "dark/light mode" was such an innovative/killer feature, when the same feature was available decades ago.
  - xg15 5y ago
    Like iOS gaining the revolutionary feature of displaying up to two(!) apps side-by-side simultaneously. I also noticed that received Windows versions don't even have the option of changing the system font anymore. Even changing the font size is only possible in a tightly restricted range and is framed as an accessibility feature, not a customisation. Sometimes it feels like customisation is removed so you can have more things available that can be announced (or sold) as "features"...
whywhywhywhy 5y ago
End of the day the UI framework choices of the past on Windows has made a consistent UI an impossibility. Too many parts of it from a different era that they can’t really update the UI for all seemingly built with slightly different tooling. If there was someone with the vision to truly drag this OS forward they would be aiming to rewrite at least a handful of these tools to modern tech consistently each release. Of course many users will scream because things are changing but honestly if they want to move forward they have to ignore them. And by forward I mean forwards to being the best desktop OS. OSX currently holds that crown because they were willing to throw everything out. OSX likely won’t exist anymore in 5-10 years the way Apple is heading so Microsoft actually has a chance here if they get serious.

2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago

Its on the "dev ring" of the insider build reserved for the jankiest WIP builds and they even warn you when using it. We just love to hate Microsoft so much that we attack unfinished software for being unfinished.

simonblack 5y ago
We just love to hate Microsoft so much that we attack unfinished software for being unfinished. Conditioned response. <grin> We're so conditioned to Microsoft's "finished" software being unfinished, that this seems 'normal' procedure.

rkagerer 5y ago

You can't perform a nice, clean Windows 11 installation yet, sadly—you'll need to use Windows Update to mangle an existing Windows 10 installation instead. This says it all, really. My impression is this is just the latest patches with some fresh lipstick painted on. Would be pleased to be proven wrong.

passivate 5y ago
Personally, I don't care how the features are delivered - OS re-install, OS upgrade, small patch update, or w/e. I'm interested in the TPM2 derived features. Don't care much for the usual UI fluff in newer versions.

rthomas6 5y ago

That's because every other Windows build is crap, more or less. Then it gets fixed up in the next iteration. Windows 3.1: Good Windows 95: Crap Windows 98: Good Windows 2000: Good Windows ME: Crap Windows XP: Good Windows Vista: Crap Windows 7: Good Windows 8: Crap Windows 10: Good Windows 11: ?